Ways to avoid using the word 'very' • Hacker News Board

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#91

Post by jerf » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:43 PM UTC

ctdonath wrote: post #78

I find such tips handy for writing. Don't use "very"; avoid starting a sentence with "I" [1]; don't end words with "ly"; avoid "to be"; etc. An excellent summary of such tips is Stephen King's On Writing . While the bulk of it is interesting (autobiography), the 16-page section "Toolbox" is a fantastic collection of writing guidance. Highly recommended, to the point that I look for opportunities to mention it. [1] -…

"Avoiding starting with 'I'" sounds context-dependent. In a journal article, sure, that's bad form, but here on HN in a more conversational environment I don't see a problem.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#92

Post by bane » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:46 PM UTC

gruseom wrote: post #51

nmc wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep in mind that, however "vachement" may sound, it is (very) familiar — almost slang. It comes from "vache" , which is the French noun for "cow" , but can also be used familiarly as an adjective that roughly translates to "nasty" . If you enjoyed "vachement" , you will be happy to know that the French noun "bœuf " (the second letter is made of an O and an E), which became "beef" in English, can also be used familia…

How interesting that the French use food for superlatives. Do we have anything like that in English? It feels weird to me, so I'm guessing no.

Not all that common, but sometimes.

"He's quite the meat head."

"He's an old salt."

"Her personality was rather spicy."

"He's a chicken."

"Don't be a fruit."

"Talking to her is like talking to a vegetable."

"She's such a potato."

"He's pretty corny around executives."

"That guy is a rotten egg."

"Her mind is like a pretzel."

"She was such a cute pumpkin."

"He's such a pig."

"He's nuts."

"What a cow."

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#93

Post by jameshart » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:48 PM UTC

sdegutis wrote: post #52

That's text. Very plain text. It even fits perfectly in a plain old HTML table. But it's an image? Wat.

Shows up on facebook walls when article is shared. Gets more clicks. Also pinnable.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#94

Post by suchow » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:48 PM UTC

odonnellryan wrote: post #82

joesmo wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this case, the rule is just not to use the word "very." I can't think of a single context where "very" doesn't degrade from the semantics and syntax of a sentence. I think this rule is appropriate to any and every style.

You've just used it, in context, effectively!

No. Joesmo mentioned it, but did not use it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use%E2%80%93mention_distinction

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#95

Post by delluminatus » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:50 PM UTC

gweinberg wrote: post #54

Isn't this ass-backwards? It seems to me that if exhausted really does just mean the same as "very tired", etc, we should be dumping all these other more intense adjectives. If your purpose in writing is to communicate, then needlessly complicating your speech with uncommon words is a bug, not a feature.

The reason this is recommended is in order to improve the specificity of description: "he was very tired" does not tell us as much about him. If you just substituted "very tired" with "exhausted" everywhere, you wouldn't be adhering to the spirit of the substitution, which is all about adding detail. Maybe his manager hates him and he is leaving work, "browbeaten and resigned", or maybe he just didn't sleep last night and he is headed to work, "clouds in his mind and lead in his limbs" or whatever.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#96

Post by samatman » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:50 PM UTC

This is the very model of a modern formal reference

The rule should be respected but not treated with due deference

The use for truth or 'verity' is evident but venerable

We very much avoid the use of very much in general.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#97

Post by InclinedPlane » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:51 PM UTC

yoha wrote: post #44

InclinedPlane wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See also: "really" and "actually". An easy way to improve your writing is to do a quick edit and remove all instances of these no-op words then go back and adjust.

I'd go further: run a analysis of word frequencies and identify the meaningless ones amongst the most frequent.

Indeed. Even if you're using a "better" word than "really" or "very" or what-have-you excess repetition of any word will dull the quality of the writing so it's a good thing to watch out for.

And it may seem that this is a mistake that is difficult to make but because of the difference between writing and reading, where one may spend many minutes or even hours writing something that only takes a few seconds to read, it's easy to forget that you've repeated a word too often.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#98

Post by brightsize » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:52 PM UTC

maw wrote: post #47

sker wrote: post #37

I was always bothered by the overuse of the word "pretty" on the Internet in place of "very." As a non-native English speaker, I grew up thinking of pretty as synonym of beautiful. Now that I see everyone using it as they would use very , I find it hard to parse.

Where I grew up we used "wicked" as an intensifier, as in "he is wicked nice." Sound any better?

"Wicked" was extremely common in Vermont where I grew up, and I expect it still is. I sometimes find myself using it in everyday speech and it never seems to raise an eyebrow even out west here. "Friggin" is another word that I think is mostly a New England thing.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#99

Post by bane » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:55 PM UTC

The problem with style guides is that they're often conflated by both the reader and the writer as rulebooks. They should instead be used as sources of writing ideas, or communication improvement aids -- to target writing for specific audiences.

English can be assembled in all kinds of wonderful and creative ways. The best writing is when you coin a phrase that style guides insist shouldn't work, but communicate something beautifully. "Most excellent", for example, is a wonderful example. It's concise, it's nonstandard and it's brings about vivid imagery of two time travelling wanna be rock stars.

The worst style guides are outright wrong. "very afraid" doesn't mean "terrified". How lame does "be afraid, be very afraid" sounds as "be afraid, be terrified"? "very poor" doesn't mean "destitute", I grew up very poor, but we were never destitute. Being "very rude" is has a very different connotation from "vulgar". This guide takes finely graded connotations and turns them into extremes.

It's worth using it to double check if what you mean is the extreme, and you accidentally used something else, but beyond that, a search and replace of "very " with any of these suggestions is likely to make your writing worse.

English can be beautiful, enjoy it.

Re: Ways to avoid using the word 'very'

#100

Post by habosa » Mon, Feb 17, 2014, 6:58 PM UTC

When I was in high school we couldn't use the verb "to be" in assignments for English class. No is, am, are, was, were, has been, will be, etc.

Of course this is overly restrictive, but 80-90% of the time there was a better way to phrase the sentence if you thought about removing the "be" verb. 10% of the time it was awkward, which sucked.

Aside: also taught me that MS Word has a very advanced find feature where I could give it "be" and it would find me all of the above conjugations.