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Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

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Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#91

Post by starky »

NovemberWest wrote: post #13

I worked for a big company where security was a big thing. I had to have an ID badge to enter the building. My boss once admitted to requesting the logs to determine if people on the team were really showing up on time to work. So I was aware the information could be used in let's say a predatory fashion for things not immediately obvious. However, I once had an ugly run in with another employee I did not know while…

The big issue with using access control and security cameras for tracking people is that they are some of the worst possible ways to track someone. As you discovered, it really comes down to a bunch of tedious scrubbing through video trying to find the few seconds of interesting video. Access control makes it somewhat easier, but then you have issues when people just follow another person in instead of using their fob. Tracking people via cellphones and other similar methods is far easier and effective right now.

You could make a lot of money in security if you were able to come up with a reliable way of tracking people via surveillance cameras, particularly in mapping persons movements and identifying when they aren't behaving as expected. Unfortunately this is exactly where it gets too easy to invade people's privacy. It is just a matter of time before we are able to do this, and we really need to have some way of limiting the invasion of privacy while still allowing for these systems to be used in positive ways.

Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#92

Post by sliverstorm »

gamerdonkey wrote: post #70
sliverstorm wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading about direct TPMS, it's a shame that the sensors have to be battery powered. I was excited for a minute, thinking maybe they manage to power the device with radio waves, the same way a passive RFID chip replies using power harvested from the query.

Or some other creative solution for supplying power. I mean, it's a shame these devices don't regularly experience some kind of predictable motion that could be used to generate electricity.

TPMS sensors already have enough problems, adding moving parts would be the proverbial straw...

Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#93

Post by 6d0debc071 »

enoch_r wrote: post #84
6d0debc071 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are they wrong? Did you not just increase their liability by 0.001%? If people with lower risks didn't pay for people with higher risks, there'd be no insurance market. If you can perfectly predict what's going to happen to someone - and you charge them all exactly what it's going to cost, + your overheads, then there's no reason they should buy insurance rather than putting the money into an investment plan. Actua…

This is simply not true. People are risk averse, and buy insurance to protect them from unlikely negative outcomes, not because they believe that the insurance company will, on average, pay out more than they pay in premiums. I can invest $200 a month for the next 10 years, or I can buy health insurance. On average, I will have more money after 10 years of investing. But the additional $24,000 of savings will increas…

This is a good point, and I have to admit I hadn't thought of it from quite that angle. I guess I'd have to reiterate my point to diminoten; that being in the same risk pool as people with a higher risk is a questionable decision. Certainly my risk might not be perfectly predictable, but to the extent that it is predictable, I don't see why I should pay for you as well.

If I set up a company that just took enough from you to cover your predicted risk - and the risks of people like you - plus some small charge for me, I could charge you less for it than a company that tried to cover everyone.

Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#94

Post by NovemberWest »

starky wrote: post #91
NovemberWest wrote: post #13

I worked for a big company where security was a big thing. I had to have an ID badge to enter the building. My boss once admitted to requesting the logs to determine if people on the team were really showing up on time to work. So I was aware the information could be used in let's say a predatory fashion for things not immediately obvious. However, I once had an ugly run in with another employee I did not know while…

The big issue with using access control and security cameras for tracking people is that they are some of the worst possible ways to track someone. As you discovered, it really comes down to a bunch of tedious scrubbing through video trying to find the few seconds of interesting video. Access control makes it somewhat easier, but then you have issues when people just follow another person in instead of using their fo…

I had fantasies there would be videotape with legible audio of the first encounter in the parking lot and pics of the second encounter at the access road next to the parking lot. There were no cameras trained on either the parking lot or the access road. The camera in the stairwell had no audio and I kind of want to say it took stills every couple of seconds or something, not video, but I do not really recall. Regardless, I was shocked. The cameras everywhere and ID bagdes, etc, turned out to be far less Big Brother Is Watching You than I had believed prio to that incident.

As far as privacy in the future, I think one thing that will happen will be cultural adaptation. I think that is already occurring. I often discuss "personal" things online with acquaintances and strangers that I rarely discuss in person with acquaintances or strangers. This has nothing to do with being shy and everything to do with opportunity to have a meatier discussion online. If I need to give a lot of background info, I can do that online in ways I cannot do in person. For example, I can give links that give additional info for those that need it.

So I think new technology is already redefining what kinds of info are socially acceptable to divulge and changing how people react to knowledge about things that were previously much more deeply secret. As technology continues to evolve, we will face new questions about situations that never existed before. These days, people routinely wrestle with questions about handling social media, online privacy, etc. Those were questions that did not exist when I was growing up. No one has outlawed FaceBook even though, for example, people have been fired for things they said there.

Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#95

Post by Zigurd »

greedo wrote: post #69
Zigurd wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aaaand that is why single payer means more freedom and not less, as the tinfoil/tebag axis would have it.

Until you start getting denied treatment for "risky behavior." Oh, and the ad hominem makes you look like an idiot.

Is there a single payer program anywhere that denies treatment for risky behavior, or that even has tighter restrictions on transplant candidates?

The big concrete example of how a national health insurance system operates differently from a "free market" in insurance is that pre-existing conditions are covered. That's a pretty big step away from restrictive conditions. How do you make the argument that a single payer would reverse that?

Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#96

Post by dingaling »

andy112 wrote: post #36
Steko wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alanis level irony: millions of people use Ghostery and most aren't aware it tracks them and sells their data.

Source? Is the opt-in feature noted here [1] what you're referring to? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghostery#Criticism

Or go straight to the source, Evidon's FAQ page:

https://www.ghostery.com/faq#q16

"GhostRank data helps them market to consumers more transparently, better manage their web properties, and comply with privacy standards. "

And when GhostRank is enabled it isn't perceived as being a bad thing by the advertising industry:

“When a new web tracker comes on the scene, they often want to be listed in Ghostery. It’s proof that they’ve arrived and have influence"

says the CEO, at

http://venturebeat.com/2012/07/31/ghostery-a-web-tracking-bl...

Re: Think You Can Live Offline Without Being Tracked? Here's What It Takes

#97

Post by greedo »

Zigurd wrote: post #95
greedo wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until you start getting denied treatment for "risky behavior." Oh, and the ad hominem makes you look like an idiot.

Is there a single payer program anywhere that denies treatment for risky behavior, or that even has tighter restrictions on transplant candidates? The big concrete example of how a national health insurance system operates differently from a "free market" in insurance is that pre-existing conditions are covered. That's a pretty big step away from restrictive conditions. How do you make the argument that a single paye…

Because it's easy to see how the nanny state would love to restrict you from buying large sodas (NYC) or other "risky" behavior.
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