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Programming is a Terrible Job

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Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#91
Nobody seems to be addressing the author's recommendation about specializing instead of being "just" a software engineer. Is specialization really the road to less boring coding? As a recent entrant into the working world I find myself thinking that may be the road to more interesting work, but don't have much of an idea about what the day-to-day work of a specialist is.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know if it's easy or hard. I'd bet it's rather on the easy side. What I know is that it's not with having dealines to produce the next product that anybody will have the time to take some step back and come with a better (more automatic) way of doing things. What's painful, it's not doing something repeatitive. It's being presured to repeat it, without being let automatizing it, which is what we should do as…

I had a colleague once that wanted to invest 4-8 hours writing a script that would save her about 1 hour each time it is run. The script was expected to be ran about once a week. She did the wrong thing and asked her boss. "Not enough time, there's more urgent things to do." She then lost an hour per week, contributing to the general sense of urgency that she lived under. Of course, this wasn't the only such script s…

frankly, it sounds like she could have simply taken the initiative and wrote the script on her own time. seems like she could have simply done it over a weekend, and it would have been worth it if she truly felt that it would save her an hour per week.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#93

I've felt this way before. Dejected that the my new job wasn't an exciting candy land of save-the-day hacks and movie montage of elegant code spanning the screen. My expectations were too high. I thought we would always do the right thing to kick out software all grown up ready to take on the world. When the realization set in I got angry. First at the job then at myself. I held it tight knowing someone was to blame.…

I really agree with your sentiments here.

I would say that if you work on a very large scale system with an explicit way of how things are done and there is extreme rigidity in doing anything differently than the job gets tedious quite fast.

I would venture to say that most developers do not fall into this category and have more autonomy (even if that is just building a CRUD web app). Most code isn't peer reviewed and the emphasis is on getting results. Within those boundaries one can do so much to keep things interesting.

I also find it interesting that as developers we sometimes feel frustrated that the end users don't understand or care about the complexity of the implementation and how much may have gone to just that single push of the button on the screen.

How much do you care about the complexity of your car, or the countless bridges that one may drive through? I can sense the complexity behind it but at the end of the day, I enjoy that is come down to turning on the ignition.

Every profession has these issues. Ask the newly grad civil engineer who's tasked to work on a bridge. What do you think they get to do? They get handed the mother of all books on how a bridge is built and everything important that needs to be considered. Their job becomes one of plug and play as there is only so many ways one can build a safe bridge. I had one of my professors relate this story and he couldn't handle it. He went on to graduate school and become an engineering professor.

For better or worse, we get some say on how that bridge gets built, as long as it stays and functions as a bridge by the end of it.

I find a lot of developers just give up, shifting responsibility from internally to external factors. It's hard to see someone just going through the motions, not evening really trying because the job has become "boring". It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy as the company starts to recognize this and eventually puts someone more inclined in the same position.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#94
I'm approaching 20 years of doing this and I would love to have 20 years more.

What this really sounds like, and the message gets muted by the complaints, is that the author wants you to find a part of software that interests you and follow that path. I agree 100%. Some people love front-end Javascript websites and all that entails. I find it painful. I still do it when called for but my true love is in low level protocols, embedded programming, hardware, and anything else that let's me get to the "bare metal". It too can be mundane and painful, but I find joy digging through RFCs and implementing them, pushing and popping from the stack, handling memory, and a bunch of other stuff that others might find completely boring.

So I do agree - it can be boring and you should always be looking for something you truly like doing. There is so much in this industry, the world is wide open to you.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#95

There's a reason it is called work and not play. If work was always enjoyable, then they wouldn't need to pay you to do it. I think the author is delusional if he thinks any programming anywhere doesn't have large swaths of time that are a bit mind numbing. And my experience has been the programmers who think themselves 'above that' are the ones that provide the least value. Our job is not to program, our job is to c…

This is true in any academic field: Poetry, history, math, physics, engineering...

The nice thing about computer science is you can make a decent living out of your hobby. The not so nice thing - you have to do what people pay you to do, whether they are customers are bosses. It's still a much better living than a poetry expert makes.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#96
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If work was always enjoyable, then they wouldn't need to pay you to do it. Why do football players, musicians and movie actors get payed 1000x as much as the software engineers who made the technology to make possible their success? TV, Internet, radio, now all HD quality. So that some people can enjoy their work and earn millions while we who invent and produce the infrastructure should suck it up and call it work…

> Why do football players, musicians and movie actors get payed 1000x as much as the software engineers who made the technology to make possible their success? Do you think their jobs are cake walks? You think football players really enjoy the training, really enjoy destroying their bodies on a weekly basis? You think musicians haven't toiled for years and years making no money at all before reaching the level where…

It's incredible to me how hard these guys work and the level of ambition they have.

I always say Tom Cruise, Christian Bale, etc. (pick any major actor) would have been successful in their life no matter what since they have the incredible drive and discipline to achieve their goals.

I also get just a bit frustrated when we boil everything down to "software/tech runs the world" so we should be glorified in some way. Well, sewage systems also run the world. I certainly don't recall or care who built that.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#97
post #55

There's a reason it is called work and not play. If work was always enjoyable, then they wouldn't need to pay you to do it. I think the author is delusional if he thinks any programming anywhere doesn't have large swaths of time that are a bit mind numbing. And my experience has been the programmers who think themselves 'above that' are the ones that provide the least value. Our job is not to program, our job is to c…

> If work was always enjoyable, then they wouldn't need to pay you to do it. Why do football players, musicians and movie actors get payed 1000x as much as the software engineers who made the technology to make possible their success? TV, Internet, radio, now all HD quality. So that some people can enjoy their work and earn millions while we who invent and produce the infrastructure should suck it up and call it work…

While I was reading OP's article, I remembered a blog post by an actor. The blog was gone, but basically what he said was that even those who were lucky to act for full-time in Hollywood, 95% of their work is mundane stuff. Basic training. Networking. Auditions. Imagine that you take job interviews twice a week and once hired for 3 months you take employee evaluation every day. That's their life.

They endure that life because they know the door that opens to the field where they can do what they want is only reachable through this muddy road.

I program both for work and for fun, and I can understand that. (I also act, only occasionally, and yeah, regular programming job is a lot more stable and low-risk, so it's understandable that the upside is a lot lower.)

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#98

One of the author's frustrations, seeing months of work abandoned - is the byproduct of training programmers as scientists and engineers rather than designers...or rather it is the byproduct of a pedagogy which attempts to extend mathematical logic and proofs to messy social problems. Landing pages and NoSQL backends are not deductively better or worse: at best they are statistically or inductively so. Typically, how…

"Teach students the practice of coming up with three independent design schemes and developing each to the point that the merits and flaws of its underlying design concept is evident. Maybe one is worth developing." That seems like a good idea but then you would need software designers and programmers because what is good for one is not good for the other. We're no were near this becoming a reality.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#99
My advice would be - do not become a "software engineer".

My advice would be - become a solver of other people's problems who happens to know how to develop software.

This may sound like a futile exercise in semantics, but believe me, this subtle little shift in thinking has made all the difference...

In order to escape OP's "boring as shit" programming life and have a ball turning nothing into something, one has to change their perspective: It's not about the code, or the elegance, or us, or what we become; it's about solving our customers' problems. That's it.

It doesn't matter if the solution requires the most elegant algorithm ever conceived or smacking someone on the side of the head; solving the problem is where the rush comes from. The elegant and cool code is the byproduct.

Once OP understands this, he'll be too busy building and solving to rant.

Re: Programming is a Terrible Job

#100
post #99

My advice would be - do not become a "software engineer". My advice would be - become a solver of other people's problems who happens to know how to develop software. This may sound like a futile exercise in semantics, but believe me, this subtle little shift in thinking has made all the difference... In order to escape OP's "boring as shit" programming life and have a ball turning nothing into something, one has to…

Solving the problem should be what you're looking to do. Learning how to solve the problem with the current tools also helps.

edw is right - avoid that "Software Engineer" label. It's a pipe dream of broken promises

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