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How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

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Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#91
Every time I read about machine learning work that is being done at Google, that's available if you're a Real Googler, and then compare that to the closed-allocation nightmare the other 90% face, it makes me want to fucking rage out and fly a plane into Mountain View...

... land, get off that plane, take a cab, and have a polite but blunt conversation with the founders about how to fix their company. (What did you think I meant?)

Artificial intelligence is nice, brahs, but natural stupidity in the form of closed allocation and Enron-style performance reviews are putting that company at 10% speed. Clear out the latter and you'll have plenty more muscle for the former.

I'm sure Ray Kurzweil will do amazing things, but he'd do even more amazing things if the company still had the machinery (e.g. open allocation, a culture of human decency) to bring talent to him properly. The whole reason he is there is to work with great people that the company is supposed to be better equipped to find than he is... but how will that work, given that the company sold off its ability to reward and recognize talent just to appease McKinsey?

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#92
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As annoying as the approximation can be, I'd like a citation for "to drive ad views". It seems much more likely that it was added for the obvious reason - to improve search results, on average, for most people, because relevant results don't always contain the exact search term you put in. In my case, as many times as it's burned me, there have also been a few where I remember it presenting exactly the results I want…

Whatever the reason. It has changed recently and is annoying. Search for "vertx play framework" and the last two search results don't have the term vertx despite pages and pages of results with the term. I don't understand how dropping search terms can make the results more relevant. Also you can't set the default search to verbatim. You can only hack the query parameters in specific browsers.

Add quotes around vertx.

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#93

Is it just me, or does Ray Kurzweil seem to be getting younger? I remember seeing a speech of his a few years ago, he had a nervous tick where he was blinking his eyes constantly. He also looked a lot older. Now, he doesn't have that tick, seems to have more hair, etc. I know he takes like 100 pills every day

The photo in the article is from Wikipedia, where the date is listed as "before 2005".

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#94

Every time I read about machine learning work that is being done at Google, that's available if you're a Real Googler, and then compare that to the closed-allocation nightmare the other 90% face, it makes me want to fucking rage out and fly a plane into Mountain View... ... land, get off that plane, take a cab, and have a polite but blunt conversation with the founders about how to fix their company. (What did you th…

I'm a little curious - have you done machine learning work that's made it into a real product?

I tried doing it a bit with my last project. My results were basically terrible. It turns out that getting useful results out of heterogenous, vague, fuzzily-specified real world data is really hard.

I'm tight with a few folks in Search Quality whose job is that sort of data-scientist machine-learning work, and they're really good at it. Y'know what 90% of their daily time is spent on? Compiling golden sets. Labeling training data. Running MapReduces to collect basic statistics about their data set. Running MapReduces to identify representative members of their data set, and outliers that should be excluded. Shoving data into R to visualize it. Futzing with numeric coefficients. Building webpages and tools so they can visualize the data and results, futz with the numbers online, and get feedback in real time. Collecting test sets and running your algorithm against them, and then trying to figure out why your losses are losing.

Machine-learning from a practitioner's POV is not at all like the textbooks and theoretical papers suggest. I'd estimate that less than 10% of one's time goes into the "fun" part of machine learning - brainstorming new signals and writing the code to extract them and feed them into your classifier - and 90% is on the kind of grunt work that hard science grad students do all the time. You get paid well for it, but that's because a lot of the work is really boring and time-consuming. I suspect that I get a far more frequent rush of accomplishment as a mostly-UI guy than the data scientists in my department get.

It's a tool. It works well in some cases, but it can take a lot of effort to get it to work well.

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genius or hard work will get you a solution to the problem you set out to solve. You need "grandiose, obsessive and deluded" in order to set out against a sufficiently ambitious problem. And you're listing people who have made discoveries. Kurzweil isn't trying to discover an equation or a law of nature, he's trying to build strong AI. That's a different category of endeavor. It's the work of Henry Ford or Steve Jobs…

Wow. Henry Ford or Steve Jobs. So, the discovery of the nature of cognition, a scientific endeavor that has stumped tens of thousands of the most brilliant people who ever lived for thousands of years, is on the order of setting up assembly lines and setting up shiny packaging for other people's engineering work. I learn new things here everyday.

Heh, not only that, but it implies that discovering the fundamental secrets of the universe isn't "sufficiently ambitious" compared to making things more efficiently or making easier-to-use gadgets.

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Sadly, you are in a minority. Google's results are excellent for most people. Sadly, you are in a minority. Bing's results are excellent for most people. Slap a Google logo and I'm willing to bet that most people wouldn't tell the difference. It's the Google brand that is golden, at least so far. But lately people are talking and questioning their honesty.

Bing's own comparison site "bing it on" shows that most users prefer Google's results[1], even though the comparison uses results modified to favor Bing[2]. [1] http://blog.paulnshapiro.com/bingiton-google-wins/ [2] http://www.punditpress.com/2013/02/the-bing-challenge-yes-it...

dear Googler, you made me waste a bit of time: trying to do that by using tweets isn't accurate for obvious reasons. Power user vs normal user, motivation to tweet, bias against Microsoft etc. The other post was confusing as hell, I couldn't make out his point. Absolutely no data, other than suggesting that the poll was rigged. It may very well be.

You may want to check this http://searchengineland.com/figz/wp-content/seloads/2013/04/... from http://searchengineland.com/users-prefer-google-even-when-15... It's impartial, afaik, and almost 70% like Bing results with the Google logo vs around 30% o Google results with the Bing logo. Amazing since that case shows that people liked the Bing results and had their preferred company's logo on Google. (Not sure if Bing had anything to do with that study though)

Either way, if Bing narrowed the preference to 10%-20%, it's a great feat. Personally I find Bing lacking on obscure terms but most people wouldn't care.

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> As annoying as the approximation can be, I'd like a citation for "to drive ad views". Not 100% proof but ad views and clicks seem to be increasing by 20% to 30% each quarter. Google tests everything to death and they please wall st with those ad click increases.

If you look at the quarterly earnings reports, it's typically 20-30% year over year, not quarter over quarter. Keep in mind that the population of internet users is estimated to be growing about 10% year over year alone (though not always in places where Google is dominant), google's usage rate is still increasing in many places outside of the US, and then there's the fact that we all use the internet more every year…

A lot can be attributed to more ads on pages, true. But do people go there to see a page full of ads or "most relevant" and "unbiased results"? How many know ads from content?

But growth in places where Google makes its real money (US, EU, Canada etc) has plateaued for a while, IIRC. Growth in ad clicks mirrors growth in revenue and we know a click from Guatemala is not the same as one from NYC.

>>Besides, without any other data or even a clear mechanism of action, you could just as easily say they're just better achieving their stated goal of only showing ads that the people who see them are interested in seeing.

Maybe, but if you read the comments, people are accusing Google of making results worst to boost the ad click rate. That's wrong on so many levels.

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#98
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not in love with the personally tailored search experience as it stands. I'm totally OK with searching "#{my_city} taxi" instead of "taxi" if it means when I search "abortion" I get a sampling of search results that has the greatest co-citation... instead of something that myopically focuses on Google's perception of my preferences. At the least, I'd like to be able to switch off the personalization. But anyway..…

If only there were a way to predict that users searching for "taxi" tend to want local results, and users searching for "abortion" don't. You know, like that other search engine does, called, um, Google: https://www.google.com/search?q=abortion https://www.google.com/search?q=taxi Or if you were willing to type more than 2 words into the search box before blaming Google for failing to read your mind, while you simult…

I believe he's trying to say that he doesn't want results tailored to him at all. For example, if I were republican, I'd tend to get anti-abortion material when searching.

He seems to be saying that he'd be okay with typing in his city name to get local results in exchange for not having any personalization. In other words, it's beyond local vs non-local.

Re: How Ray Kurzweil Plans To Revolutionize Search At Google

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatever the reason. It has changed recently and is annoying. Search for "vertx play framework" and the last two search results don't have the term vertx despite pages and pages of results with the term. I don't understand how dropping search terms can make the results more relevant. Also you can't set the default search to verbatim. You can only hack the query parameters in specific browsers.

Add quotes around vertx.

This is where I miss the old + sign.
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