Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children • Hacker News Board

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#91

Post by alexgieg » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 9:50 AM UTC

cubefox wrote: post #86

alexgieg wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try knowing some in real life. I know dozens, and it's really hard not to think of them as psychologically being of the opposite gender. This tracks with the fact that neuroimaging of trans brains shows that the areas in which male and female brains differ are either of the opposite gender or have in-between values.

> Try knowing some in real life. I know dozens, and it's really hard not to think of them as psychologically being of the opposite gender. I'm not sure what you mean with "opposite gender" (given that "gender" is now often no longer considered a synonym for "sex"), but I can tell you that all the MtF people I knew from college registered to me simply as men trying to act like women.

Yes, you did understand what I meant, don't be disingenuous.

As for the second part, you imply they were failing at that. Can you describe those failures?

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#92

Post by alexgieg » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 10:05 AM UTC

tosti wrote: post #88

alexgieg wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's first a matter of different connectomes. Their brains are physically those of the opposite gender, as shown by several studies using advanced neuroimaging and by autopsies. The mental/psychological effects of those brains being that way are effects of those very physical differences. To fix that, we'd need microneurosurgery on the level of science fiction. Maybe in a few decades we will, but right now, resha…

Oh really? If a psychriatic disorder would warrant changing the environment the brain lives in, rather than any other therapy, why stop at gender disphoria? Could the MPS people get surgerey so they have more mouths, limbs or even entire bodies except the brain? How about the schizo? Would treatment involve a set of VR goggles with a program that randomly generates perpetually morphing fantasy worlds? How about we ma…

First and foremost, you're incurring in a slippery slope. Do you want reality, as complex as it may be, or merely to win an argument?

Second, you don't see it because you don't care for their problem, otherwise you'd either learn what the actual hard scientific research on the topic by neurologists and psychiatrists show, as well as the measurable results of the different clinical protocols developed by psychiatrists and psychologists, or defer to their expertize. You yourself "not seeing why" what they do in such cases is what needs done is as meaningless as you "not seeing why" any expert does what they do in fields you're not yourself an expert in. So either become one, or stop getting in their way based on "common sense"-based cognitive errors and biases.

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#93

Post by tosti » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 10:29 AM UTC

alexgieg wrote: post #92

tosti wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh really? If a psychriatic disorder would warrant changing the environment the brain lives in, rather than any other therapy, why stop at gender disphoria? Could the MPS people get surgerey so they have more mouths, limbs or even entire bodies except the brain? How about the schizo? Would treatment involve a set of VR goggles with a program that randomly generates perpetually morphing fantasy worlds? How about we ma…

First and foremost, you're incurring in a slippery slope. Do you want reality, as complex as it may be, or merely to win an argument? Second, you don't see it because you don't care for their problem, otherwise you'd either learn what the actual hard scientific research on the topic by neurologists and psychiatrists show, as well as the measurable results of the different clinical protocols developed by psychiatrists…

I care about people and my children and grandchildren in particular. Are you really implying common sense isn't what got us here so far? That common sense would get in the way of future geberations? Are you also really using the logical fallacy argument on me while disregarding your hypocrisy?

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#94

Post by cubefox » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 12:53 PM UTC

alexgieg wrote: post #91

cubefox wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Try knowing some in real life. I know dozens, and it's really hard not to think of them as psychologically being of the opposite gender. I'm not sure what you mean with "opposite gender" (given that "gender" is now often no longer considered a synonym for "sex"), but I can tell you that all the MtF people I knew from college registered to me simply as men trying to act like women.

Yes, you did understand what I meant, don't be disingenuous. As for the second part, you imply they were failing at that. Can you describe those failures?

There is nothing to describe, it was just obvious.

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#95

Post by foco_tubi » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 2:21 PM UTC

cubefox wrote: post #90

foco_tubi wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying you believe if children use puberty blockers they will develop male traits? Are you saying you would cite Reddit as a valid source? Oof.

> Are you saying you believe if children use puberty blockers they will develop male traits? They will fail to develop their respective sex-typical traits, which in turn is typical of the opposite sex. > Are you saying you would cite Reddit as a valid source? Is there any reason to think the Reddit report is fake? If not, it is fine for me to refer to it. Besides, you were the one asking for a reference. Do you think…

That’s not how puberty works. Delaying puberty doesn’t make a child develop the “opposite sex’s” puberty. A boy on puberty blockers doesn’t start growing breasts because of the blockers, and a girl doesn’t develop a deeper voice because of the blockers. Puberty blockers pause sex-hormone-driven development. They don’t replace testosterone with estrogen or vice versa. The absence of masculinization is not feminization, and the absence of feminization is not masculinization.

I’m not implying that the single Reddit post you refer to is fake. I’m stating that relying on a single Reddit post as the basis of your entire argument is factually weak.

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#96

Post by cubefox » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 2:57 PM UTC

foco_tubi wrote: post #95

cubefox wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you saying you believe if children use puberty blockers they will develop male traits? They will fail to develop their respective sex-typical traits, which in turn is typical of the opposite sex. > Are you saying you would cite Reddit as a valid source? Is there any reason to think the Reddit report is fake? If not, it is fine for me to refer to it. Besides, you were the one asking for a reference. Do you think…

That’s not how puberty works. Delaying puberty doesn’t make a child develop the “opposite sex’s” puberty. A boy on puberty blockers doesn’t start growing breasts because of the blockers, and a girl doesn’t develop a deeper voice because of the blockers. Puberty blockers pause sex-hormone-driven development. They don’t replace testosterone with estrogen or vice versa. The absence of masculinization is not feminization…

> The absence of masculinization is not feminization, and the absence of feminization is not masculinization.

It is, to a certain degree. An man/woman who didn't develop several of their respective sex traits will automatically appear more feminine/masculine because these are polar opposites.

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#97

Post by foco_tubi » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 5:58 PM UTC

cubefox wrote: post #96

foco_tubi wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not how puberty works. Delaying puberty doesn’t make a child develop the “opposite sex’s” puberty. A boy on puberty blockers doesn’t start growing breasts because of the blockers, and a girl doesn’t develop a deeper voice because of the blockers. Puberty blockers pause sex-hormone-driven development. They don’t replace testosterone with estrogen or vice versa. The absence of masculinization is not feminization…

> The absence of masculinization is not feminization, and the absence of feminization is not masculinization. It is, to a certain degree. An man/woman who didn't develop several of their respective sex traits will automatically appear more feminine/masculine because these are polar opposites.

That is entirely subjective, from a biological standpoint you couldn’t be more wrong

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#98

Post by cubefox » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 6:33 PM UTC

foco_tubi wrote: post #97

cubefox wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The absence of masculinization is not feminization, and the absence of feminization is not masculinization. It is, to a certain degree. An man/woman who didn't develop several of their respective sex traits will automatically appear more feminine/masculine because these are polar opposites.

That is entirely subjective, from a biological standpoint you couldn’t be more wrong

Quite the contrary, it makes perfect biological sense for all kinds of sexually dimorphic animals.

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#99

Post by foco_tubi » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 6:44 PM UTC

cubefox wrote: post #98

foco_tubi wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is entirely subjective, from a biological standpoint you couldn’t be more wrong

Quite the contrary, it makes perfect biological sense for all kinds of sexually dimorphic animals.

Perhaps it makes sense to you, but I’m not surprised by that at this point

Re: Puberty blockers trial can start recruiting children

#100

Post by UncleMeat » Sun, Aug 02, 2026, 7:12 PM UTC

ipaddr wrote: post #32

summermusic wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"In a review of 27 studies involving almost 8,000 teens and adults who had transgender surgeries, mostly in Europe, the U.S and Canada, 1% on average expressed regret. For some, regret was temporary, but a small number went on to have detransitioning or reversal surgeries, the 2021 review said." https://apnews.com/article/transgender-treatment-regret-detr...

Dutch study (Steensma 2013) followed 127 children who were referred to the Gender Identity clinic in Amsterdam under the age of 12. The study looked to see if these children were still gender dysphoric by the time they reached adolescence at age fifteen. 37% of these children had persisted. However 64% of children had either desisted or were no longer traceable. Since there is only one Gender Identity clinic for chil…

> desisted or were no longer traceable

So this includes both detransitioners and people who just changed their phone number. Not exactly something where we can assume that all of these people were unhappy with their transition.