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Japanese symbols that speak without words

arun.is

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Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#91

Post by Tor3 »

netsharc wrote: post #3

The logo expressing "Limited Express" is very unspecific, imagine if buses with the Mercedes star cost extra and didn't stop at every stop. Interesting that a lot of US road signs have words on them: https://ygraph.com/graphs/roadsigns-20120316T030941-ekrruua.... , or are obvious, whereas in Europe drivers need to learn what they mean: https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEh... For example the yi…

The "Limited Express" logo existed only until the railway was privatized, if I read the article correctly. In any case I haven't noticed it, and you know when a train is a limited express - it's right there on the board announcing incoming trains (and if it's your train then you already have a limited express ticket and you know the exact time it arrives). And, finally, there's an audio announcement which says that it's a limited express. But I'll look for the logo the next time I'm at the station, it would be interesting if it's still there. I actually hope so.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#92

Post by freetime2 »

mendigou wrote: post #85
freetime2 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Suppose the car in lane 1 is going slower because they just merged from a left-side entrance ramp. Just to clarify, my original post was more about merging from a faster lane of travel into a slower lane, or where both lanes are traveling at about the same speed. When merging into a faster lane I agree the slower moving car should wait for a suitable opening before signaling and merging. And there are cases where i…

The slower car should signal the moment they decide they need to merge into the lane, then wait for an appropriate gap.

The Massachusetts handbook [1] says:

> Use your rearview mirror, check your blind spots, and use your directional signals when changing lanes. Remember these three steps: (1) look, (2) signal, (3) move

To me this means you don't signal until it's actually safe to merge. E.g. if a car is passing me at high speed, I wouldn't turn on my signal until after they had passed. If I did it before they pass, they might think my intent is to merge in front of them, and slam on their brakes, move into a different lane, etc.

In Japan [2] the process is 1) check rearview and side mirrors, 2) turn on blinker at least 3 seconds before turn, 3) while the blinker is on, do a shoulder check for blind spots 4) merge, 5) flash your hazards 2-3 times to thank the driver who let you merge.

So you're also checking for safety before signaling. Step 5 isn't actually required by the way but it's quite common and a nice touch I think.

These are of course cases where you have the option of moving into a faster lane at your discretion. If your lane is coming to an end, you should probably signal well before the end of the lane (although I would still wait to get up to speed before signaling).

[1] https://www.mass.gov/doc/english-drivers-manual/download Page 95

[2] https://groups.oist.jp/ja/resource-center/things-remember-pr...

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#93

Post by dkdbejwi383 »

pegasus wrote: post #88
wetwater wrote: post #53

This is a classic case of "Thing in japan". Yes 'wakaba' mark is cool. But the exact same point can be made about a big red L . Far more ubiquitous. Also there are beautiful medieval crests on British Fire engines. I doubt that purely wordless, symbolic system was truly the ultimate pinnacle of operational clarity.

If all you see there is something "cool", you're missing the more rewarding depths. These symbols speak of a society which was at the other extreme end to the fragmentation, atomization, and attention span erosion we are experiencing today. This allowed them to elevate esthetics to a point we couldn't afford to today. I'm thinking here mainly of those ancient Mon[1] symbols – though something of their spirit lives on…

This is just the trope of the "wise and mystical oriental"

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#94

Post by Karliss »

what wrote: post #59
Telaneo wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Symbols are hard. They can be done well. I don't think many would mind changing a 'call' button with a '[telephone receiver icon]' button, but those kinds of examples are probably in the minority.

> telephone receiver icon It’s weird because no one has a phone that looks that way now. Does the younger generation even know that it’s a phone? Same with a lot of software iconography.

I don't think it's much worse than having an icon of mobile phone from 90s with a grid of buttons and external antenna. Almost no one is using those either. And a featureless rectangle with rounded corners in the shape of modern smartphone doesn't make a good icon. The best you can do is rectangle with circle for pre iphone X style home button or more generic slots for speaker/microphone which still makes a bad icon and are going away.

Having an icon of smartphone in a smartphone for the call app wouldn't be very helpful. And considering modern usage a smartphone doesn't even a have a strong association with calling.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#95

Post by unpopularopp »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #54
wetwater wrote: post #53

This is a classic case of "Thing in japan". Yes 'wakaba' mark is cool. But the exact same point can be made about a big red L . Far more ubiquitous. Also there are beautiful medieval crests on British Fire engines. I doubt that purely wordless, symbolic system was truly the ultimate pinnacle of operational clarity.

I would love to read your article about the beautiful medieval crests on British fire engines, too! No joke, feel free to link something in reply to my comment as well if you have existing articles. I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan. Write about the ones you know about!

>I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan.

That's the point of the whole meme. People think it's interesting because of Japan not because of the content itself is interesting.

Did you know there are 12,000 Zabka stores in Poland and they are almost as ubiquitous as konbinis? Guess what, no gives a fuck because it's not Japan but an eastern European country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%BBabka_(convenience_store)

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#96

Post by psp99 »

unpopularopp wrote: post #95
quadrifoliate wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to read your article about the beautiful medieval crests on British fire engines, too! No joke, feel free to link something in reply to my comment as well if you have existing articles. I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan. Write about the ones you know about!

>I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan. That's the point of the whole meme. People think it's interesting because of Japan not because of the content itself is interesting. Did you know there are 12,000 Zabka stores in Poland and they are almost as ubiquitous as konbinis? Guess what, no gi…

[dead]

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#97

Post by moondowner »

unpopularopp wrote: post #95
quadrifoliate wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to read your article about the beautiful medieval crests on British fire engines, too! No joke, feel free to link something in reply to my comment as well if you have existing articles. I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan. Write about the ones you know about!

>I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan. That's the point of the whole meme. People think it's interesting because of Japan not because of the content itself is interesting. Did you know there are 12,000 Zabka stores in Poland and they are almost as ubiquitous as konbinis? Guess what, no gi…

"no gives a fuck" is a bit dramatic

there are memes about zabka on social media as well (i've personally seen some on insta and tiktok), maybe not in the same scale, but there are.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#98

Post by freetime2 »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #54
wetwater wrote: post #53

This is a classic case of "Thing in japan". Yes 'wakaba' mark is cool. But the exact same point can be made about a big red L . Far more ubiquitous. Also there are beautiful medieval crests on British Fire engines. I doubt that purely wordless, symbolic system was truly the ultimate pinnacle of operational clarity.

I would love to read your article about the beautiful medieval crests on British fire engines, too! No joke, feel free to link something in reply to my comment as well if you have existing articles. I feel like there has been a lot of unnecessary pushback about 'Thing in Japan' articles on the internet. Guess what, there are cool things everywhere; including Japan. Write about the ones you know about!

IMO the author kind of opened themselves up to it when they said:

> And still, in my life here in the United States, words are still needed to convey meaning.

As if the US doesn’t have easily identifiable police and firefighters. Or handicap placards/license plates. Or public transportation logos (such as the NY MTA logo).

I think Japan does a pretty good job with signage in general and some of it is interesting to read about. Some things like the newbie sticker might be worth adopting elsewhere. Other things like the old people sticker might be considered age discrimination in other countries.

But framing it like only Japan knows how to use symbols or “read the air” is just dumb.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#99

Post by aa-jv »

wetwater wrote: post #53

This is a classic case of "Thing in japan". Yes 'wakaba' mark is cool. But the exact same point can be made about a big red L . Far more ubiquitous. Also there are beautiful medieval crests on British Fire engines. I doubt that purely wordless, symbolic system was truly the ultimate pinnacle of operational clarity.

This is a classic case of "open misanthropy".

People can love the Japanese for their unique characteristics and they can love the Japanese for the things they appropriated from other cultures. Just like the British.

Fact is though, in many ways, Japanese culture is a lot more caring, considerate and kind than the British.

>I doubt that purely wordless, symbolic system was truly the ultimate pinnacle of operational clarity.

Agreed, but only because Brits aren't really good at designing things for longevity, whereas the Japanese are great at it.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#100

Post by aa-jv »

dkdbejwi383 wrote: post #93
pegasus wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all you see there is something "cool", you're missing the more rewarding depths. These symbols speak of a society which was at the other extreme end to the fragmentation, atomization, and attention span erosion we are experiencing today. This allowed them to elevate esthetics to a point we couldn't afford to today. I'm thinking here mainly of those ancient Mon[1] symbols – though something of their spirit lives on…

This is just the trope of the "wise and mystical oriental"

Hey, I mean this seriously: you might be a racist misanthrope.
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