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Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

bbc.com

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Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#91

Post by Projectiboga »

Aurornis wrote: post #72
reenorap wrote: post #36

The article acts like ibogaine is a newly discovered drug. This is an old hallucinagenix drug that has helped thousands of people get over ptsd. The only thing holding this back is government bureaucracy and red tape. I’m happy that people will get there chance to benefit from this after decades of stupid government policy.

> The only thing holding this back is government bureaucracy and red tape. Not really true. There have been clinical trials for Ibogaine over the years in the US and abroad. The United States isn’t the only country capable of running trials. A big blocker for ibogaine is that it’s cardiotoxic. Multiple deaths have occurred within clinical trials for ibogaine. It’s really hard to justify and get approval for additiona…

Those deaths were clustered in an earlier time frame. Standard practice now is to monitor cardiac symptoms and administer IV Magnesium and sometimes Phosphorus to nudge the heart rate back to stability.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#92

Post by Jarwain »

cbonanno wrote: post #85

I’m sorry, but people really need to understand how these drugs “treat addiction“. ibogaine acts on an opioid receptor. So all you’re doing is changing one opiate for another. It acts on the KOR receptors instead of the MOR receptor, which most openly act on. But it’s not like you’re going to be cured from opioid addiction. You’re just replacing one opioid with another that doesn’t affect the respiratory system.

You say this like "oh it's just acts on a different kind of opiod receptor" means that it's not meaningfully different.

Your comment also seems to imply that this treatment involves consuming ibogaine habitually or regularly

The protocol for ibogaine treatment, according to the article and the experiments being done, do not have this requirement.

Like other treatments involving psychedelics and hallucinogens, the protocol here is that a one-off treatment, a single dose, results in meaningful improvements in both addictive behaviors and PTSD symptoms a month later and potentially longer

This is not the same as something like methadone or naltrexone, which _are_ what you describe: replacing a more harmful opiate with a less harmful one.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#93

Post by Projectiboga »

cbonanno wrote: post #85

I’m sorry, but people really need to understand how these drugs “treat addiction“. ibogaine acts on an opioid receptor. So all you’re doing is changing one opiate for another. It acts on the KOR receptors instead of the MOR receptor, which most openly act on. But it’s not like you’re going to be cured from opioid addiction. You’re just replacing one opioid with another that doesn’t affect the respiratory system.

Actually it purges a small amount of brain cells deep in the center of the brain, that handles automatic movement. It also seeds a bunch of cofactors stimulating nerve growth factors and that area then regrows back with less of the addiction hardwired. It also helps to prop up the mood for a couple of months to give the person a chance to get going in another direction.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#94

Post by ipaddr »

dacops wrote: post #8

Only veterans? I wonder about the editorial choice to use veterans rather than, say, women who have PTSD from assaults, which is a much larger group of people. (Approximately 4% of US men and 8% of US women experience PTSD every year across all reasons like accidents, sexual assaults, combat, etc.) Presumably this treatment would help everyone? Or is it somehow supporting only vets?

They are an easy group to recruit or reach and have complete medical histories on file. Remember this is a military study.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#95

Post by cluckindan »

H8crilA wrote: post #13

I always wonder why ECT doesn't get more press. It very very often works on depression (and bipolar disorder, catatonia; anything affective-related really), although the effects may wane over time when the treatment is discontinued. Memory loss is one of the side effects, and it could actually be beneficial here.

Anecdotal, but I had a friend who had ECT for their depressive symptoms.

They ended their life a few years afterwards.

So no, ”very often works on depression” is not a characterization I would use.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#96

Post by cluckindan »

KolibriFly wrote: post #31
H8crilA wrote: post #13

I always wonder why ECT doesn't get more press. It very very often works on depression (and bipolar disorder, catatonia; anything affective-related really), although the effects may wane over time when the treatment is discontinued. Memory loss is one of the side effects, and it could actually be beneficial here.

It's strange how much attention novel psychedelic treatments get compared with older, less glamorous interventions that already help a lot of people

Bring back lobotomy!

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#97

Post by cluckindan »

the__alchemist wrote: post #60
tokai wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are completely wrong. Its kinda scary how confident you are in your misunderstanding.

Is this pair of sentences indented to be satirical?

No, you are just wrong.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#98

Post by cluckindan »

cbonanno wrote: post #85

I’m sorry, but people really need to understand how these drugs “treat addiction“. ibogaine acts on an opioid receptor. So all you’re doing is changing one opiate for another. It acts on the KOR receptors instead of the MOR receptor, which most openly act on. But it’s not like you’re going to be cured from opioid addiction. You’re just replacing one opioid with another that doesn’t affect the respiratory system.

Kappa-opioid receptor activation causes a person to feel intense dissociative dysphoria. Pretty much the opposite of why people use opioids.

Re: Trials on veterans suggest ibogaine could provide a new treatment for PTSD

#99

Post by boxed »

lstodd wrote: post #16
boxed wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or LSD, or magic mushrooms.

Or DMT. I also question how they derive the consclusion of a "horrible heart risk". Imo there is not enough evidence for that.

I mean.. considering the alternatives of magic mushrooms which also have very promising results in early trials and have, afaik, no such scary side effects it seems like any risk big enough for doctors being needed close by seems bad.
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