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OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

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Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#91

Post by MagicMoonlight »

vrganj wrote: post #84
pama wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Peter shows the near-term future. Raw API consumer price cost is arbitrary. (The frontier labs can put a 100x markup to cover other operational expenses.) The true cost of inference with same-capability models keeps dropping at dizzying rates, especially at the data-center batch size. (Due to both NVidia hardware and algorithmic changes.) So the developments that Peter can achieve today with internal support from Ope…

But.... why ? Like I read his thing on how he spends the tokens [0] and it sounds like satire. He has agents write shitty code for features other agents think other people want, then has it reviewed by other agents in hopes of catching bugs that the first agent put there, then has some more agents try to find security bugs in the now double-agented code to make it triple-agented and at the end of the day, he spent a…

[flagged]

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#92

Post by 12arwlaz »

wiseowise wrote: post #42
zxornand wrote: post #5

And was he 5x more productive in those 30d than a years worth of a dev making 200k/yr? Doubtful lol, dudes killing the environment just for fun at this point.

> And was he 5x more productive in those 30d than a years worth of a dev making 200k/yr? He was. When it comes to marketing. This is was most people don't understand. Peter is a great marketing guy who got hired because of a hype vision, not because he is an outstanding engineer. Think of it like OpenAI hiring MrBeast of the coding world.

That is a good comparison. He has the charm and output quality of Mr Beast, but also his marketing prowess.

Now let's wait until the moderators clean up the wrongthink. He also has censors on his side.

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#93

Post by H8crilA »

Philip-J-Fry wrote: post #53
Robdel12 wrote: post #39

Once you see how much crap they’re running to police the agents on the repo, you’ll ‘get’ the spend https://x.com/steipete/status/2055405041843052792 I won’t lie, if I had the access to this, I’d do the same exact thing.

But it's a self fulfilling prophecy. They need all this stuff because it's a vibe coded app where bugs are randomly introduced, the architecture is overcomplicated and sucks, and stuff is just added for the fun of it. Do existing companies run entire end-to-end product integration tests on every single change they make to a repo to make sure something hasn't broken? No, they just architect things in a way such that a…

OpenClaw has surprisingly few "dumb" bugs. Is it as stable and secure as the Linux kernel? God no, obviously not. But it has never just crashed for me, for example. Bugs are of the type "X with Y and Z disabled and T turned on - doesn't work", where you're likely one of a few people that have ever tried this combination. Not to mention it can then debug itself and file a bug report, with a bugfix - if you give it a GitHub token.

I run it in a firewalled VM and am very conscious about any tokens I give it access to - so far for all I know this was unnecessary.

PS. for me the core feature of OpenClaw isn't the cron, though that is nice. It's the memory and instant extensibility. Like it takes 5-15 minutes to add an SSH tool where all agent requests go through a manual review, together with a good auto loaded description that just works in all future sessions.

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#94

Post by Grosvenor »

Terretta wrote: post #49
Tiberium wrote: post #24

This is quite a misleading title because this is the raw API cost, but he (obviously) has unlimited usage as an OpenAI employee. Moreover, if you use e.g. the $200 Codex sub, you get about ~$5k-$6k monthly API usage if you spend every week of your usage, if not more, which shows that the raw API cost is not how much it (likely) costs to OpenAI, unless they're subsidizing all this. He did clarify that it was with fast…

Even at unlimited budget, there is a crossover where outsourcing thinking to the machine costs more than the machine. What I mean by this: 1. Intern, analyst, junior, or offshore level coding is cheaper when done by the machine. // Side note: There is good reason the industry invests in suboptimal output from this set which moves to the "cost" column when using an LLM, but nobody's accounting for that. 2. For the int…

> I would expect that within a couple years, these other disciplines can be baked in enough the machine costs less for everything but surprises.

They already are. I’m successfully using frameworks like bmad to deliver complex apps at that level. My job is to manager the see, as, ux, sre processes and catch errors.

I spend more time refinding prd , epics and stories than I do elbows deep in code.

If I don’t like the output of a story I nuke it change the story and have the flanker try again. I’m using the open source glm, kimi, deepseek models. I expect the full pipeline to be good enough by the end of the year.

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#95

Post by shimman »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #91
vrganj wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But.... why ? Like I read his thing on how he spends the tokens [0] and it sounds like satire. He has agents write shitty code for features other agents think other people want, then has it reviewed by other agents in hopes of catching bugs that the first agent put there, then has some more agents try to find security bugs in the now double-agented code to make it triple-agented and at the end of the day, he spent a…

[flagged]

If history is anything to go by, he'll likely lead YC within the decade.

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#96

Post by arkadiytehgraet »

ianm218 wrote: post #12
thomasahle wrote: post #6

He used 600B tokens in 30 days. I use more than 150B/month with just 15 codex accounts. 60 accounts is "just" $12,000/month. So Peter could "save" 100x by using monthly accounts. Of course, he doesn't have to, as he works at OpenAI now.

What do you do with all those accounts?

Probably trying to fix their broken personal website with the half of the links there not working at all.

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#98

Post by simianwords »

vrganj wrote: post #84
pama wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Peter shows the near-term future. Raw API consumer price cost is arbitrary. (The frontier labs can put a 100x markup to cover other operational expenses.) The true cost of inference with same-capability models keeps dropping at dizzying rates, especially at the data-center batch size. (Due to both NVidia hardware and algorithmic changes.) So the developments that Peter can achieve today with internal support from Ope…

But.... why ? Like I read his thing on how he spends the tokens [0] and it sounds like satire. He has agents write shitty code for features other agents think other people want, then has it reviewed by other agents in hopes of catching bugs that the first agent put there, then has some more agents try to find security bugs in the now double-agented code to make it triple-agented and at the end of the day, he spent a…

>He then has the sense of humor to call this grotesque process "incredibly lean".

> What's the point in all of this? What problems is this solving? Who's benefiting?

The economy doesn't work like how you think it does. Its not central planning. All the usages aren't detailed in a specification, submitted for approval to 100 agencies and then allowed to be used.

It shows lack of intellectual curiosity to not engage deeply with obviously profound technology and what the implications are. I find this exercise helpful.

Peter is predicting how LLMs will be used in the future when the prices go down. And they will definitely go down. I think his predictions are correct and we will definitely have something similar to OpenClaw.

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#99

Post by simianwords »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #91
vrganj wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But.... why ? Like I read his thing on how he spends the tokens [0] and it sounds like satire. He has agents write shitty code for features other agents think other people want, then has it reviewed by other agents in hopes of catching bugs that the first agent put there, then has some more agents try to find security bugs in the now double-agented code to make it triple-agented and at the end of the day, he spent a…

[flagged]

I don't understand how he is a scam artist. Lots of people are using the things he built. TBH this kind of rhetoric is a bit degrading experience on this website

Re: OpenClaw Creator Spent $1.3M on OpenAI Tokens in 30 Days

#100

Post by simianwords »

wiseowise wrote: post #42
zxornand wrote: post #5

And was he 5x more productive in those 30d than a years worth of a dev making 200k/yr? Doubtful lol, dudes killing the environment just for fun at this point.

> And was he 5x more productive in those 30d than a years worth of a dev making 200k/yr? He was. When it comes to marketing. This is was most people don't understand. Peter is a great marketing guy who got hired because of a hype vision, not because he is an outstanding engineer. Think of it like OpenAI hiring MrBeast of the coding world.

_yawn_ I keep hearing "hype vision". What part of openclaw is hype? It literally works and the adoption has gotten better.

We really need better standards for disagreement.

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