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Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

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Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#91

Post by beng-nl »

dehrmann wrote: post #69
ahhhhnoooo wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you had a big enough battery, could you sell electricity back to the grid later? Get paid to charge the battery, get paid to discharge the battery? It seems silly, but actually... it's driving useful behavior I suppose. Then again, maybe a good government would notice this and just fast track grid storage rather than distribute that work to all the citizens.

Someone at the utility went through the same math you are and decided it isn't worth it at scale. It's probably not worth it at small scale.

Back of the envelope I did one time told me i could earn more by picking up cans off the street and trading them for the deposit.

Still, it would feel nice - after the initial cost- to have very cheap power (only charge when cheap).

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#92

Post by maxerickson »

heyitsmedotjayb wrote: post #67
martinald wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worth thinking how this would work if it didn't work like this though? Nearly all 'commodity' markets clear this way. If you switched to 'people get paid what they bid' it's almost certain the market would just converge back to this anyway - but with a lot more gaming and guesswork (wind guessing the gas marginal price to try and get the highest price).

Unregulated free markets optimizing for the least efficient, and highest possible price to the consumer? That's interesting, because its 100% the opposite of what I've been told my whole life.

Why do you see it that way?

The idea behind the regulation is that it's providing the maximum incentive to bring cheaper electricity to market.

If you try to mandate that high cost producers charge less, they will do what makes sense to control costs and then quit altogether once they are losing money.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#93

Post by blitzar »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #47
turblety wrote: post #45

This is amazing news. I look forward to my bills going up again next month!

Why are people making (intentionally?) vague statements about prices going up? Are you referring to the war Trump started, or are you all climate denying loons who love Trump and think net-zero is a Chinese hoax? Or just nihilists that just think the world is going to shit in multiple ways and refuse to even contemplate small silver linings on dark clouds? It's impossible to tell from these quips.

Only 3 certainties in life; death, taxes and the cost of everything going up every year.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#94

Post by blitzar »

argsnd wrote: post #55
jmyeet wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I couldn't disagree more. I'm going to point to Gary Stevenson [1] for why. He could probably get to the point faster but here's the core premise: Europe responded to the energy shocks since 2020 by transferring the better part of a trillion euros to energy companies in the US and the Middle East, particularly for LNG. Imagine where Europe might be if half a trillion euros was spent on renewables. The core problem as…

Useful background on Mr. Stevenson https://www.ft.com/content/7e8b47b3-7931-4354-9e8a-47d75d057...

Everyone on TV gobbing off about anything is a grifter.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#95

Post by 7952 »

rcxdude wrote: post #31
pjc50 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, we're (UK) only just at the "occasionally cheap 100% renewables" state, and it's maddeningly slow progress. But it seems like a lot of things are suddenly coming online, like battery storage, and the Scotland-England grid upgrade will happen in the next few years. https://eandt.theiet.org/2026/04/02/ps12bn-plan-upgrade-scot...

The transition will probably be quite nonlinear: getting from zero to a few days a year of 100% renewables is about as much effort as going from a few days a year to most of the year.

Plug in solar could be like that.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#96

Post by 0cf8612b2e1e »

ndr42 wrote: post #49
martinald wrote: post #43

The issue though is that the UK spends something along the lines of £10-25bn (depending how you count subsidies) a year on renewable. Something like £10bn in direct subsidies via CfD and RO, then another ~£1.5-2bn on curtailment (paying wind farms to turn off), ~£3bn in balancing market costs, and £6bn on transmission upgrade costs (passed back to consumers/businesses) to upgrade transmission for nearly always renewa…

Why replace oil dependency with uranium dependency (presumably from Russia)? Costs are not the only consideration.

Australia has the world’s largest uranium reserves. Many European countries have their own supply and could produce it if they desired to be self sufficient.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#97

Post by mperham »

martinald wrote: post #43

The issue though is that the UK spends something along the lines of £10-25bn (depending how you count subsidies) a year on renewable. Something like £10bn in direct subsidies via CfD and RO, then another ~£1.5-2bn on curtailment (paying wind farms to turn off), ~£3bn in balancing market costs, and £6bn on transmission upgrade costs (passed back to consumers/businesses) to upgrade transmission for nearly always renewa…

Isn't it better to build a decentralized grid out of standard parts than a few highly complex nuclear reactors? To me, that makes the system more resilient and easier to maintain. Nuclear seems like a worse choice long-term than wind/solar/batteries. Balcony solar could get us nuclear reactor levels of power per year once broadly legalized.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#98

Post by youngtaff »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #48
triceratops wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to make the same comments in every thread about renewable energy regardless of what's actually happening.

Nice to see you again. Yeah, i feel it's a political thing where green initiatives are being pushed against the interest and benefit of voters. The benefits are continually overhyped and frankly in the UK we are seeing none of them. I actually quite like the idea of renewables and don't entirely understand Trumps pathological hatred of them, but i don't think politicians hamstringing our economy to win green points w…

So cleaner air, more efficient buildings etc is against the interests and benefits on the voters>

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#99

Post by ErroneousBosh »

pjc50 wrote: post #16
jl6 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electricity prices in the UK are painful, and galling when set by the price of gas, but it’s worth remembering that this model and all this expense has bought a major asset that will only become more important and strategic. The next milestones to hit are: * A 10x increase in generation capacity * A 100x increase in storage capacity * A 1000x increase in seasonal storage capacity * Electrification of heating * Electr…

Yeah, we're (UK) only just at the "occasionally cheap 100% renewables" state, and it's maddeningly slow progress. But it seems like a lot of things are suddenly coming online, like battery storage, and the Scotland-England grid upgrade will happen in the next few years. https://eandt.theiet.org/2026/04/02/ps12bn-plan-upgrade-scot...

> and the Scotland-England grid upgrade will happen in the next few years.

I hope not. We're currently getting shafted by National Grid pricing, and this is only going to mean we get to pay even more for electricity where it's generated while the south coast of the UK gets it cheap.

Re: Record wind and solar saved UK from gas imports worth £1B in March 2026

#100

Post by crote »

dehrmann wrote: post #69
ahhhhnoooo wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you had a big enough battery, could you sell electricity back to the grid later? Get paid to charge the battery, get paid to discharge the battery? It seems silly, but actually... it's driving useful behavior I suppose. Then again, maybe a good government would notice this and just fast track grid storage rather than distribute that work to all the citizens.

Someone at the utility went through the same math you are and decided it isn't worth it at scale. It's probably not worth it at small scale.

There is no such thing as "the utility" in Europe. It is legally not allowed for a single company to both operate (parts of) the grid and trade in electricity.
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