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r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

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Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#91

Post by TheChaplain »

Seems a lot of commenters here dislike their decision, I like it though. LLM-generated projects, articles, blogs are low-effort products lacking authenticity.

And the discussion on LLM itself can in the long run be fairly tiring, follow r/LocalLLaMA for a while and you'll see what I mean. But if you are really into LLMs though, that sub is great.

It is simply not fun to go on to a subreddit, seeing 90% being projects and blogs that is obviously created using AI, and authentic content being pushed to the side due to the high volume of artificial works. r/Python was horrible at one point, but the mods have been stepping up their game.

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#92

Post by redox99 »

simianwords wrote: post #27

There’s something off about Reddit. Either I grew up or it became hollow from within. Just angry people scolding each other all the time. There are some true gems however but usually in smaller focused subreddits.

Reddit turned way more into an echo chamber over time. The moderators and the downvote system destroyed the site. The shift from free speech, libertarian and anarchist ideology into heavily left leaning definitely didn't help.

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#93

Post by dwb »

tovej wrote: post #62
jyrkesh wrote: post #44

I know this snarky, I'm sorry ahead of time. But I don't know how else to make this point... The fact that the people running r/progamming don't know not to wait until April 2 to publish this tells me that they don't have real-world experience in shipping software in a business environment. We are SO past the point of software being developed without LLMs at _all_, the trend line is never going to reverse. I don't un…

I have yet to run into any serious project in the wild that is using LLMs for development. I have seen vibecoded intern prototypes that took half a day to vet and dismiss because they were completely useless. I'm sure your experience is different, but you can't _seriously_ claim we're "past the point" of not using LLMs for programming. Vibecoding is a fundamentally different kind of activity than actual programming.…

Ok well I have plenty of serious, production-level professional experience that says otherwise. Not “vibe coding” - we certainly review the code. It’s a tool that has downsides and failure modes, of course, but it’s at the point where it’s definitely speeding us up and we are using it a lot. Trust me, I’d prefer a world, on balance, where this wasn’t true – I don’t like many of the aspects and uses of the technology – but its utility in programming is undeniable now and the capitalists aren’t taking “no” for an answer.

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#95

Post by southerntofu »

yoz-y wrote: post #70
klustregrif wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't understand the people digging in as zero LLM absolutists. Relevant read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luddite I feel like it’s easy to understand what’s motivating these individuals to take that stance.

Definitely not the same. Luddites were fighting for humane working conditions; breaking machines was just a means to an end. They weren’t doing it because machines were the problem. Anti AI crowd on the other hand just doesn’t like AI. A modern equivalent of a Luddite would be someone going on strike to protest firings.

You are being overly dismissive of a mindset you obviously don't understand. Of course being anti-AI is about decent living conditions for humans. Most of us don't believe in singularity or Matrix-style threats.

But current AI is actively destroying our breathable/livable planet by drawing unmatched quantities of resources (see also DRAM shortage, etc), all the while exploiting millions of non-union workers across the world (for classification/transcription/review), and all this for two goals:

1) try to replace human labor: problem is we know any extracted value (if at all) will benefit the bourgeoisie and will never be redistributed to the masses, because that's exactly what happened with the previous industrial revolutions (Asimov-style socialism is not exactly around the corner)

2) try to surveil everyone with cameras and microphones everywhere, and build armed (semi-)autonomous robots to guard our bourgeois masters and their data centers

There is nothing in this entire project that can be interpreted to benefit the workers. People opposing AI are just lucid about who that's benefiting, and in that sense the luddite comparison is very appropriate.

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#97

Post by lifthrasiir »

altairprime wrote: post #22
whytevuhuni wrote: post #11

Maybe this was a genius move made precisely to be ambiguous on whether it was April Fools or not... so that the author can later read the room and clarify whether it was or was not April Fools, without much repercussion either way.

Nope: > Timing just worked out this way. New month, ideal timing for testing a new rule.

Or so one says. (Not necessarily saying that it was a bad decision.)

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#98

Post by hperrin »

btheunissen wrote: post #53
jyrkesh wrote: post #44

I know this snarky, I'm sorry ahead of time. But I don't know how else to make this point... The fact that the people running r/progamming don't know not to wait until April 2 to publish this tells me that they don't have real-world experience in shipping software in a business environment. We are SO past the point of software being developed without LLMs at _all_, the trend line is never going to reverse. I don't un…

I hate AI video, I hate AI art, but if you are pretending that AI isn’t going be writing code for 99% of projects going forward you are absolutely kidding yourself.

AI will be writing the code for shit-slop apps and libraries. The good ones will be written by humans.

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#99

Post by hperrin »

redox99 wrote: post #83
yoz-y wrote: post #61

Good decision. AI programming is fundamentally different from programming and as such the discussions merit to have separate forums. If r/programming wants to be the one solely focusing on programming then power to them. Discussing both in combination also makes sense, but the value of reddit is having a subreddit for anything and “just programming” should be on the list.

> AI programming is fundamentally different from programming It's really not. Maybe vibecoding, in its original definition (not looking at generated code) is fundamentally different. But most people are not vibe coding outside of pet projects, at least yet.

It very much is. It’s more like telling an intern what to do and then reviewing their code. Anyone can do it, and it results in (mostly) slop.

Re: r/programming bans all discussion of LLM programming

#100

Post by balgg »

petterroea wrote: post #85
petterroea wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I totally get the rule. I use LLMs when developing. In fact, I've been out of Claude tokens for the week since Wednesday, but I use Claude specifically for the boring, simple stuff I don't really want to do, but that Claude can. I'm simply not interested in discussing anything LLMs are able to do, it's not interesting. It makes sense that a programming subreddit first and foremost discusses programming (the skil…

Following up, anecdotally, people I talk to who are excited about LLM development usually either care more about product development, or don't have programming skill enough to see how bad the software is. Nothing wrong with either, but it can get tiresome.

> people I talk to who are excited about LLM development usually either care more about product development

This is an interesting thing I've also noticed in public hobbyist forums/discussion spaces where someone who is more interested in making a "product" clashes with people who are just there to talk about the activity itself. It's unfortunate that it happens but it will self-correct over time (like /r/programming here) and the LLM enthusiasts of Reddit will find another place to discuss ways of using them.

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