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Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

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Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#91

Post by troupo »

roysting wrote: post #70
troupo wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay. Now you've ranted. You have anything more substantative than rants?

You seem not to know what a rant is. Two questions that make you uncomfortable because they challenge your dogmatic beliefs is not it though. You are very disappointing.

Rant: "to speak, write or shout in a loud, uncontrolled, or angry way, often saying confused or silly things"

Rant: "a long, angry speech or piece of writing : TIRADE; a bombastic extravagant speech"

Which your rant is. And your rant completely ignores the meat of my comment.

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#92

Post by troupo »

roysting wrote: post #59
troupo wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nuclear takes like 15 years to build 6-7 years. France built 40 its nuclear reactors in a decade, at 6-7 years per reactor. Right now China is building reactors at 6-7 years per reactor. --- start quote --- Nearly every Chinese nuclear project that has entered service since 2010 has achieved construction in 7 years or less. Every single conventional commercial-scale reactor project in Chinese history has achieved c…

You are right to point out the astonishing developments in Chinese nuclear reactors technology most people are totally oblivious of. It has been standardized, is seemingly safe and far more efficient due to Chinese technological advancements; however you may be overlooking that the ability, the capacity to do that, to do what France did by installing 56 nuclear reactors due to the last oil shock, takes an industrial…

> That is who is basically the dictator of Europe

Tell me how your opinion can be dismissed in its entirety without telling me

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#94

Post by mopsi »

drysine wrote: post #71
troupo wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> NATO, NATO would not be moved eastward. 1. Which Gorbachev himself said never happened 2. Before 2014 almost no one in Ukraine wanted to join NATO. After 2014 almost everyone wanted to join NATO. After 2022 Sweden and Finland ran to NATO. > it's not Russia's business if NATO decides to expand. Countries bordering Russia literally run to NATO the moment they have a choice. I wonder why. It couldn't be Russia who's t…

>Which Gorbachev himself said never happened He lied.[0] No one wants to look like a fool. >Before 2014 almost no one in Ukraine wanted to join NATO. After 2014 almost everyone wanted to join NATO. Pro-Western Ukrainian president submitted request to join NATO in 2008 and the NATO response was positive. And your statement is false, before 2014 there was significant minority that favored joining NATO and after 2014 th…

  > He lied.[0] No one wants to look like a fool.
He didn't. Talks about NATO's future were limited to East Germany alone and written down into the articles 4 and 5 of the so-called "4+2 treaty" from 1990, which settled the post-reunification status of East Germany. In the treaty, it was agreed that foreign NATO forces would not enter East Germany before Soviet forces had withdrawn (by 1994).

The treaty: https://web.archive.org/web/20220116001812/http://foto.archi...

It's absurd to even suggest anything beyond that, because post-reunification Germany was to border the Warsaw Pact. Even theoretically, there was nowhere for NATO to "expand." Gorbachev's team did not foresee the dissolution of the Warsaw Pact the following year.

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#95

Post by _aavaa_ »

drysine wrote: post #21
Joeri wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The majority of Belgium’s electricity comes from nuclear, wind and solar. They have been greatly expanding wind parks in the north sea, and they’re in the early stages of deploying SMRs. But the reality is that Belgium still needs a lot of natural gas for electricity production and its large chemical industry, and that all of this gas has to be imported. Long term there is the European hydrogen strategy which aims to…

What about heating?

Heat pumps

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#96

Post by _aavaa_ »

troupo wrote: post #15
Scarblac wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nuclear takes like 15 years to build, it's being worked on but it won't be much more relevant soon. Green energy isn't very useful for heating in winter.

> Nuclear takes like 15 years to build 6-7 years. France built 40 its nuclear reactors in a decade, at 6-7 years per reactor. Right now China is building reactors at 6-7 years per reactor. --- start quote --- Nearly every Chinese nuclear project that has entered service since 2010 has achieved construction in 7 years or less. Every single conventional commercial-scale reactor project in Chinese history has achieved c…

At the start of 2025 China didn’t manage to reach their 2020 nuclear target, much less their 2025. Meanwhile they met their 2030 target.

Look at their total extra energy generation (including capacity factor) comparing renewables and nuclear: https://cleantechnica.com/2023/02/06/renewables-in-china-tre...

The actual lesson here is that beyond a small reserve, the case for nuclear is non existent (unless proponents are willing to stop pretending it isn’t about nuclear weapons).

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#97

Post by drysine »

troupo wrote: post #90
drysine wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Which Gorbachev himself said never happened He lied.[0] No one wants to look like a fool. >Before 2014 almost no one in Ukraine wanted to join NATO. After 2014 almost everyone wanted to join NATO. Pro-Western Ukrainian president submitted request to join NATO in 2008 and the NATO response was positive. And your statement is false, before 2014 there was significant minority that favored joining NATO and after 2014 th…

> He lied.[0] No one wants to look like a fool. Your oft-cited link doesn't support the "100% NATO said they wouldn't expand" and it's a verbal statement that wasn't even ratified anywhere. Unlike, you know, multiple treaties Russia has with, say, Ukraine. But if you're holding verbal agreements in such high esteem, Putin himself said he doesn't care if Ukraine joins NATO. > Pro-Western Ukrainian president submitted…

I gave you a link to the video where former American ambassador to the USSR is saying "though it was not a legally binding assurance, we gave categorical assurances to Gorbachev, back when the Soviet Union existed, that if a United Germany was able to stay in NATO, NATO would not be moved eastward".

You argue like you haven't seen it.

>just some the NATO members were positive

That's not true, the alliance itself gave the assurances.[0]

>the request was so unpopular

The polls consistently showed that, but it hadn't stopped Yuschenko from submitting the request.

>Russia's "security concerns": "if you subhumans don't do exactly what we say, we invade you and subjugate you, you are not a real country anyway".

And this dismissive attitude towards legitimate security concerns of Russia led to the current situation.

>This is the literal quote of what I said

You forgot to quote "Just like". "the US "midwifing" the coup in Ukraine in 2014" isn't "just like" what you wrote. Besides, you haven't even offered any sources for your statements. Is it because you blame Russia for anything you don't like?

[0] https://www.nato.int/en/about-us/official-texts-and-resource...

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#98

Post by piva00 »

mongol wrote: post #39
piva00 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Green energy isn't very useful for heating in winter. We do manage quite well to use green energy for heating during winter in Sweden.

Do we? I see plenty of complaints about high electricity prices and criticism of shutdown of nuclear reactors

We do, it's not our fault that the electricity market in the EU is such that the spot price is based on the most expensive kWh produced in the zone we supply to. It sucks that we have to pay high energy prices because Germany fucked up their energy policies, or because Poland is still mostly coal-based.

Nuclear reactors are running, Forsmark, Oskarshamn, and Ringhals are still there and producing 25% of our electricity right at this moment.

So we do, and we are getting ratfucked by the common electricity market in the EU that pushes our prices much higher than what it costs to produce.

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#99

Post by toyg »

throw310822 wrote: post #43
toyg wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> for Europe to stop allowing the US and Israel to do what they want Yes. > starting from the US arrogance that led to the war in Ukraine No. > We should go back buying gas from Russia Hell no.

Then buy it from the US at a higher price? The same US that helps Israel in occupation and genocide in Palestine and in attacking sovereign countries all around?

Still better than a permanent dictatorship built around the mafia, sorry.

Re: Italy, Belgium set to lose gas supply after biggest LNG plant bombed

#100

Post by swat535 »

honeybadger1 wrote: post #93
pcdevils wrote: post #13

More world problems. Thanks America.

oversimplification fallacy

No it's not a fallacy. This is entirely republican's fault.

In fact, republicans have completely ruined relations everywhere including with EU and Canada.

Democrats in the US have a much better foreign policy.

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