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Store birth date in systemd for age verification

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Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#91

Post by fidotron »

egorfine wrote: post #86

Given that: * LP had zero objections to merging this commit into systemd [1]; * Amutable CEO is confident they have a very robust path to revenue [2]; * It is Facebook that pushes age verification laws all around the world; I sense that his new startup is exactly what we are afraid of: a way to prevent reverting of these patch and then actually enforce the upcoming mandatory KYC to use the computer. [1] https://githu…

It's incredibly useful for adtech if all apps on Linux can access the user birthdate.

Surely this is a total coincidence.

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#92

Post by egorfine »

wolvoleo wrote: post #89
egorfine wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that: * LP had zero objections to merging this commit into systemd [1]; * Amutable CEO is confident they have a very robust path to revenue [2]; * It is Facebook that pushes age verification laws all around the world; I sense that his new startup is exactly what we are afraid of: a way to prevent reverting of these patch and then actually enforce the upcoming mandatory KYC to use the computer. [1] https://githu…

What other benefit is there to remote attestation? Because their "verification" stamp is just that. It's certainly not got any benefit for the user.

> What other benefit is there to remote attestation?

There certainly are benefits and they are huge. Like, I can make sure my servers are untampered, I would love that.

Problem is, that technology, once unveiled, will be inevitably used for surveillance. Like, online KYC required to use a computer and you cannot patch this shit out because your Linux build is attested and no banking or government website will let you log in unless remote attestation passes.

Sort of like what they do on Android devices.

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#94

Post by Ekaros »

burnt-resistor wrote: post #45
jprjr_ wrote: post #11

I cannot express how disappointed I am to see open source projects giving in to complying with age attestation laws. I feel like complying really undermines any first amendment arguments. Software is a first amendment protected form of expression, giving in before getting any actual threats from the state makes your participation seem voluntary. Systemd's participation puts the entire world into compliance with a Cal…

Techbros gonna techbro... bending the knee to fascists and privacy traitors. The next law will groom something else and eventually it will be tech requiring digital identification and approval to use the internet.

They are the fascist. They are the private companies getting in cahoots with the state for their own gains. It was always about money and thus power for them. Never about freedom.

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#95

Post by surajrmal »

egorfine wrote: post #81
bitwize wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the law. If you live in the United States, and a minor in California uses your OS that didn't check age, you could be liable for up to $2500 per occurrence. That can add up quickly if California schoolkids discover your OS does an end run around the law. When ruin is the alternative, compliance becomes non-negotiable.

Gasing the Jews was the law as well.

The two couldn't be more unrelated. The idea that age verification in an OS is bad is a niche position by a select few. You don't hear dissenting views on hackernews because the majority here belong to that group and going against the grain is down voted. On the other hand, you're comparing it to killing humans. Making everything into a moral dilemma cheapens the argument. Just because you disagree with the law doesn't give you moral high ground to ignore it. I think cookie consent questions are terrible but I'd not dream of not adding one if compelled by law

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#96

Post by iAMkenough »

ahoka wrote: post #69
iAMkenough wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Traced back to Meta lobbyists. https://tboteproject.com/

Meta gives money to the Heritage Foundation? Wild.

That's not how I read this:

> Meta spent a record $26.3 million on federal lobbying in 2025, deployed 86+ lobbyists across 45 states, and covertly funded a group called the Digital Childhood Alliance (DCA) to advocate for the App Store Accountability Act (ASAA). But the operation extends beyond Meta.

> The Heritage Foundation funds three of six named DCA coalition organizations, staffs the advocacy pipeline from Capitol Hill to state legislatures, and has merged leadership with another coalition member.

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#97

Post by curt15 »

treesknees wrote: post #30
zeratax wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there is no verification happening though

Because systemd isn’t an operating system. It’s just providing a mechanism for the OS to store/lookup the user’s birthday. It’s up to individual distros to do the verification (should the law stand and OS vendors choose to comply)

It boggles the mind how so eagerly open source projects are trying to pave the way for these laws.

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#98

Post by burnt-resistor »

Ekaros wrote: post #94
burnt-resistor wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Techbros gonna techbro... bending the knee to fascists and privacy traitors. The next law will groom something else and eventually it will be tech requiring digital identification and approval to use the internet.

They are the fascist. They are the private companies getting in cahoots with the state for their own gains. It was always about money and thus power for them. Never about freedom.

The rich have gravitated that way throughout history, from Marcus Licinius Crassus to the Business Plot to Citizens United. Greedy people gaining power to advance their greed no matter the consequences and suffering of others has and will always be a problem because it's an incurable flaw of human nature that must be regulated. The separation between church and state and wealth is required for the maintenance of individual freedom.

https://www.historyhit.com/marcus-crassus/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_Plot

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#99

Post by surajrmal »

wpm wrote: post #71
bitwize wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the law. If you live in the United States, and a minor in California uses your OS that didn't check age, you could be liable for up to $2500 per occurrence. That can add up quickly if California schoolkids discover your OS does an end run around the law. When ruin is the alternative, compliance becomes non-negotiable.

Except systemd isn't an OS. xdg-desktop-portal is not an OS. None of these projects need to flop over and acquiesce to this overreach.

This is optional functionality which a subset of their important customers want. You will continue to have options that do not make use of this feature.

As someone with children, I see benefits in how age verification will help me manage my kids relationship with technology. Even if it was not the law, I would choose products with support. The point of open source is to allow for both options.

Re: Store birth date in systemd for age verification

#100

Post by herewulf »

bravetraveler wrote: post #58
NekkoDroid wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, to get something to fail you need an implementation that can fail. And since nothing is using this so far there is nothing you can get to fail. In the end something that implements the actual communication would end up probably defaulting to "under 13" or whatever if it somehow fails to retrieve any value (or maybe not, who knows), so I wouldn't realistically see even without this, getting the attestation to "b…

Hypotheticals are truly exhausting! I had a wall of text and chopped most of it off. This started out as a joke and now it's dead, thanks. The failure/assumption of under-13 or whatever, as a result of manipulation, is fine. I'm not actually trying to solution something though, jeez. I find it more compelling to say, for instance, "x% of our users have chosen not to share their information" ... rather than "y% have n…

I think the loudest way you can protest is to use and support distros that do not have systemd. There are lots to choose from in 2026.
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