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The AI Vampire

steve-yegge.medium.com

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Re: The AI Vampire

#91

Post by TomasBM »

dwedge wrote: post #13

Every time I say I don't see the productivity boost from AI, people always say I'm using the wrong tool, or the wrong model. I use Claude with Sonnet, Zed with either Claude Sonnet 4 or Opus 4.6, Gemini, and ChatGPT 5.2. I use these tools daily and I just don't see it. The vampire in the room, for me, seems to be feeling like I'm the only person in the room that doesn't believe the hype. Or should I say, being in roo…

What things (languages etc.) do you work with/on primarily?

I don't know what to say, except that I see a substantial boost. I generally code slowly, but since GPT-5.1 was released, what would've taken me months to do now takes me days.

Admittedly, I work in research, so I'm primarily building prototypes, not products.

Re: The AI Vampire

#92

Post by zparky »

thunky wrote: post #85
exfalso wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the same experience and still use it. It's just that I learned to use it for simplistic work. I sometimes try to give it more complex tasks but it keeps failing. I don't think it's bad to keep trying, especially as people are reporting insane productivity gains. After all, it's through failure that we learn the limitations of a technology. Apparently some people encounter that limit more often than others.

> I have the same experience and still use it. It's just that I learned to use it for simplistic work. OP said "I don't see the productivity boost from AI" and that they don't "believe the hype" without any qualification, but then went on to say that they use it every day. This makes no sense to me. Isn't this like saying "I don't get anything out of reading books" immediately followed by "I read books for 4 hours ev…

to be fair, every other comment is usually screaming about how if you aren't able to utilize LLMs effectively, you will be without a job soon. most people want to keep their job, or be employable, so if LLMs are a required tool to know, they're trying to become fluent in it by using it.

Re: The AI Vampire

#93

Post by thunky »

zparky wrote: post #92
thunky wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I have the same experience and still use it. It's just that I learned to use it for simplistic work. OP said "I don't see the productivity boost from AI" and that they don't "believe the hype" without any qualification, but then went on to say that they use it every day. This makes no sense to me. Isn't this like saying "I don't get anything out of reading books" immediately followed by "I read books for 4 hours ev…

to be fair, every other comment is usually screaming about how if you aren't able to utilize LLMs effectively, you will be without a job soon. most people want to keep their job, or be employable, so if LLMs are a required tool to know, they're trying to become fluent in it by using it.

> to be fair, every other comment is usually screaming about how if you aren't able to utilize LLMs effectively, you will be without a job soon

I think a lot of these "it's all overhyped crap" posts are a hypocritical.

If someone wants to be consistent with their "it's crap" argument, they wouldn't be using it for anything. Period.

If someone says they need it for their job, then they are admitting that it's useful for their job. Because it would otherwise be irrational to use a tool that makes them worse at their job.

Re: The AI Vampire

#94

Post by thunky »

dwedge wrote: post #83
thunky wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To each their own. > I use these tools daily and I just don't see it. So why use them if you see no benefit? You can refuse to use it, it's fine. You can also write your code in notepad.exe, without a linter, and without an Internet connection if you want. Your rodeo I don't understand the defensiveness.

> So why use them if you see no benefit? I didn't say I see no benefit, I said I don't see the productivity boost people talk about. I conceded they are good for some things, and presumably that's what I use them for. > You can refuse to use it, it's fine Where do you work? Because increasingly, this isn't true. A lot of places are judging engineers by LoC output like it's 2000, except this time the LoC has to come f…

OP said nothing about their employer forcing them to use it.

What they said was: "I use these tools daily".

Re: The AI Vampire

#95

Post by Hammershaft »

Wilder7977 wrote: post #90
Hammershaft wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as a software developer affected by it, I don't think it should be banned. Productivity improvements are how we get richer in aggregate over the long term, even if those impacted (like you & me) might feel the brunt of transitional pain.

"In aggregate" means few individuals on the planet, unfortunately, not the whole collectivity. This makes your statement almost almost surreal in my eyes.

Yes, outsized gains are shifting to capital, but cheaper software development means more software & more competition which benefits people across the world.

Re: The AI Vampire

#96

Post by potsandpans »

dwedge wrote: post #13

Every time I say I don't see the productivity boost from AI, people always say I'm using the wrong tool, or the wrong model. I use Claude with Sonnet, Zed with either Claude Sonnet 4 or Opus 4.6, Gemini, and ChatGPT 5.2. I use these tools daily and I just don't see it. The vampire in the room, for me, seems to be feeling like I'm the only person in the room that doesn't believe the hype. Or should I say, being in roo…

Online forums tend to amplify and legitimize otherwise minority standpoints.

There is a well studied cognitive bias: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority. People tend to think they're special.

> The vampire in the room, for me, seems to be feeling like I'm the only person in the room that doesn't believe the hype. Or should I say, being in rooms where nobody seems to care about quality over quantity anymore.

If in real life you are noticing the majority of peers that you have rapport with tending towards something that you don't understand, it usually isn't a "them" problem.

It's something for you to decide. Are you special? Or are you fundamentally missing something?

Re: The AI Vampire

#97

Post by judahmeek »

mschild wrote: post #47
Bishonen88 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At what point does the project outgrow the AI in your experience? I have a 70k LOC backend/frontend/database/docker app that Claude still mostly one shots most features/tasks I throw at it. Perhaps, it's not as good remembering all the intertwined side-effects between functionalities/ui's and I have to let it know "in the calendar view, we must hide it as well", but that takes little time/effort. Does it break down a…

I find that with more complex projects (full-stack application with some 50 controllers, services, and about 90 distinct full-feature pages) it often starts writing code that simply breaks functionality. For example, had to update some more complex code to correctly calculate a financial penalty amount. The amount is defined by law and recently received an overhaul so we had to change our implementation. Every model…

I noticed that you said "models" & not "agents". Agents can receive feedback from automated QA systems, such as linters, unit, & integration tests, which can dramatically improve their work.

There's still the risk that the agent will try to modify the QA systems themselves, but that's why there will always be a human in the loop.

Re: The AI Vampire

#98

Post by sph »

> Many have likened [AI] to a slot machine. You pull a lever with each prompt, and get random rewards and sometimes amazing “payouts.” No wonder it’s addictive.

This is good, and terrifying insight. Sometimes it truly feels like talking to gambling addicts.

Re: The AI Vampire

#99

Post by crabmusket »

blahblaher wrote: post #18

He's totally correct on the extraction that companies do (always has been). What I kinda disagree is the notion that if a company doesn't go the same path as these others, where everyone is "10x'ing" with AI, that they will suddenly disappear. I really don't think it will work that way. Yeah, some might if another company/startup goes after their business and they build faster, but building faster doesn't mean your b…

This has been my experience even before AI. We are a small bootstrapped company, and we have major competitors with free offerings and much more resources than we have (due to VC funding or other backing). While they've achieved some success, they've come nowhere near close to out-competing us.

Paying for AI is much more accessible than getting venture funding, so it's less of a differentiator. They could pay for more AI than we could, but that's already been true with humans, and it hasn't necessarily helped.

Knowing what to build is still the game. As well as the actual business side of business - building a trusted brand, relationships with customers, smart marketing etc.

Re: The AI Vampire

#100

Post by dwedge »

potsandpans wrote: post #96
dwedge wrote: post #13

Every time I say I don't see the productivity boost from AI, people always say I'm using the wrong tool, or the wrong model. I use Claude with Sonnet, Zed with either Claude Sonnet 4 or Opus 4.6, Gemini, and ChatGPT 5.2. I use these tools daily and I just don't see it. The vampire in the room, for me, seems to be feeling like I'm the only person in the room that doesn't believe the hype. Or should I say, being in roo…

Online forums tend to amplify and legitimize otherwise minority standpoints. There is a well studied cognitive bias: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illusory_superiority . People tend to think they're special. > The vampire in the room, for me, seems to be feeling like I'm the only person in the room that doesn't believe the hype. Or should I say, being in rooms where nobody seems to care about quality over quantity an…

To say I'm the only one is an exaggeration, it's probably more around 50/50 with the 50% in the pro camp being very vocal to the point where it's almost insulting. Being given basic tasks (like, find the last modified file) with "use Claude to get the command" said straight after.

I perfectly accept that it might be a me problem, and this is why I keep exposing myself to these tools, I try to find how they can help me, and I do see it, I just feel like a lot of people ignore the ways these tools harm productivity (and here I mean directly, not some vague "you'll get worse at learning").

I accept your point, and I do take it to heart, and I do keep wondering if I'm missing something

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