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France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

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Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#91

Post by JoshTriplett »

emsign wrote: post #87
badc0ffee wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

70 million Americans voted for him. His biggest demographic win compared to the last election was non-white men. Immediately dismissing this as racism isn't going to help you understand it, or help the Democrats beat the Republicans.

To the contrary! They were tricked to believe that they were part of society. They aren't. By voting for Trump they reassured themselves that it won't happen to them. Often times racism against the newest group of immigrants coming from the group of immigrants before them is seen by the latter as a rite of passage to be accepted into US society. The Irish used to be in a similar position like the people from South Am…

It's zero-sum thinking, "the pie isn't big enough and can't get bigger and I'm afraid, so I'm going to hurt other people so that I don't get hurt".

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#92

Post by emsign »

xienze wrote: post #78
lotsofpulp wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I prefer to live by the adage of actions speak louder than words. I’m capable of lying to present a facade, and I have to assume others are too.

[flagged]

The Republican party is openly racist. More than it has ever been in the last 40 years! And you are claiming otherwise. You are actively looking the other way if you dismiss this. It's not normal and why should the Democrats copy the Republicans? So they lose the liberal voters who aren't okay with bigotry and revenge politics? Because no matter what the Democrats say, the MAGA Republicans will always beat them at that, and people will still vote for the OG racists anyway.

Your argument is coming up everytime when right-wing populists gain votes, and it's always a fatal trap. Merz in Germany claimed to beat the AfD (who is loved by Bannon and Musk and was loved by Epstein btw, all "wonderful" people), and it failed he barely made it to become chancellor. It also failed in the 90s during the first wave of racism in Germany after re-unification.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#93

Post by quadrifoliate »

spicyusername wrote: post #3

Such a shame that so many U.S. citizens do not see the ramifications of their political decisions. Each one of these actions is a stepping stone the world is taking as a direct consequence of U.S. political negligence. And however difficult it was to render this consequence, it will be tenfold, or hundredfold, as difficult to reverse course.

Shame that so many EU citizens do not see the ramifications of theirs.

EU citizens have elected ineffective leaders for decades -- leaders that ignored the potential to set up homegrown cloud providers, software suites or tech companies. They have elected leaders who were until very recently heavily dependent on Russian energy.

As a result, EU dependence on US tech is near-total. I remember hearing a few months ago that companies in the EU still have to use Dun & Bradstreet (a US company) for routine government filings!

Some minor headlines about civil servants stopping their usage of office sound impressive but isn't really making a dent in Microsoft's bottom line. If and when Microsoft's revenues from the EU start dropping by double digits or more, I am sure they will contribute large amounts of money to make the US government more civil and normal than it's being today.

> And however difficult it was to render this consequence, it will be tenfold, or hundredfold, as difficult to reverse course.

As a software consumer, if this takes off, I don't see any reason I would want the course to be reversed. More adoption and support of open software and standards is beneficial for consumers. It might even get Microsoft and the rest of US Big Tech to actively compete for a change rather than relying on their near-total monopoly.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#94

Post by nxm »

FpUser wrote: post #79
badc0ffee wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk to actual Trump voters and you'll see they support his tariffs and immigration crackdowns because they believe it will lead to economic prosperity and good jobs returning to their community. They believe the current system is fundamentally unfair to them. Even though that's totally backwards, and Trump is just making everything worse, that's what they believe. Framing immigration reform as "racists think there a…

>"They believe the current system is fundamentally unfair to them" Well it fucking is. But thinking that current king can fix it is a lunacy

What was the alternative? More of the previous administration?

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#95

Post by lotsofpulp »

xienze wrote: post #78
lotsofpulp wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I prefer to live by the adage of actions speak louder than words. I’m capable of lying to present a facade, and I have to assume others are too.

[flagged]

Voting for a traitorous convicted felon is why I can't stand federal level Republican voters.

What is the point in changing the messaging when racism and sexism are at the root of the problem?

For the record, I abhor my non federal level Democrat leaders, and vote Republican on the state and local level (because they are less crazy than the Democrats at this level).

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#96

Post by JoshTriplett »

rayiner wrote: post #28

In favor of what? I’m all for economic nationalism, but you have to have competitive home grown alternatives. Does Europe have them? Or are they going to shoot themselves in the foot productivity-wise by boycotting the best products?

In no world are Teams and Zoom anywhere close to the "best products". They're awful, and only persist because of network effects or because of "the people who buy it don't feel the pain".

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#97

Post by MiiMe19 »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #84
spicyusername wrote: post #3

Such a shame that so many U.S. citizens do not see the ramifications of their political decisions. Each one of these actions is a stepping stone the world is taking as a direct consequence of U.S. political negligence. And however difficult it was to render this consequence, it will be tenfold, or hundredfold, as difficult to reverse course.

A reminder that in the last presidential election, the winner was decided by one of the smallest margins ever, and the winner only won a plurality, not a majority. Almost as many people voted against the current US administration as voted for it, so although it is true that "so many US citizens do not see the ramifications", there almost as many who do (or some version of them).

Almost as many, but not more than :)

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#98

Post by Zigurd »

larsnystrom wrote: post #38

There seems to be a huge business opportunity in Europe right now, to sell support and customization of open source software to government players. Has anyone heard about a European company that’s been successful in this area?

I had an occasion to speak to some of the wire.com people a couple years ago. They seemed to be really dedicated to security and privacy.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#99

Post by MiiMe19 »

tyre wrote: post #23

As an American, this is awesome to see. We should pay penalties for our abandonment of good faith global engagement. And economic damage really is the key to the heart of these United States of Three Corporations in a Trench Coat. We’ve seen companies and CEOs paying millions in bribes to be close to the president. Now this aligns their financial interests with shifting our foreign policy. Not how it ought to work, b…

[flagged]

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#100

Post by drdec »

wateralien wrote: post #62

Almost all businesses need email, contacts, calendars, live chat, video calls, docs, sheets, and presentations. Ideally all linked. Where is the open source foundation for this package that everyone needs?

Where are the businesses setting up and donating to an organization/foundation to pay for development of such a package?
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