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.NET 10

devblogs.microsoft.com

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Re: .NET 10

#91

Post by pjmlp »

petesergeant wrote: post #57
pjmlp wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While suffering the performance loss of V8 versus CLR, JVM or any compiled language. One of the reasons I am back to writing more C++ code is C++ addons for node.js, as several SaaS products now only care about Next.js as extension SDK.

> While suffering the performance loss of V8 versus CLR, JVM or any compiled language The number of startups for whom that performance differential matters more than developer output is tiny.

Yeah, except plenty of them are probably using Kubernetes and NoSQL, because everyone dreams to be Google.

Re: .NET 10

#92

Post by SparkBomb »

phillipcarter wrote: post #10
leetharris wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wish .NET was more popular among startups, if only C# could get rid of the "enterpisey" stigma. Too hard to ignore the benefits of cross-stack gains in Typescript/Python. The C# native phone, Blazor, etc just isn't quite there yet. Tried it at the last company, and full stack TS was just so much easier to do. The reality is that the vast majority of startups don't make it. The #1 thing startups should be focusing…

Is it though? Backends can be any language and there's a lot more variety there -- TS+node, Go, Python, Java. It's just .NET that's largely ignored for no real technical basis.

It really depends where you are. In the UK half the places seem to use .NET in some form or another.

I am pretty language agnostic and I am reasonably competent programming in C# (I worked with C# and VB.NET for about 15 years), Go, Python, TypeScript and C++ these days.

The issue with a lot of places that do C#/.NET stuff is that they will typically ignore new tech until it is officially blessed by Microsoft. You can have a piece of tech that everyone is using and works really well and it will be ignored if it isn't blessed by Microsoft.

The other issue with .NET is all the Microsoft gumpf that tends to come with it even with the newer versions of .NET.

I am also in the weird place of being a Linux user. I've had job interviews that wanted to do live coding exercise/take home code exercise and they expect you to do everything in Visual Studio with SQL Server.

Re: .NET 10

#93

Post by kopirgan »

Does this version improve or streamline the numerous options for web dev like Razor, Blazor etc? Anyone can comment on which is actually being popular

Re: .NET 10

#94

Post by netdevphoenix »

Arisaka1 wrote: post #82

Every time I read about new .NET version improvements I always remember my attempt to get a job using this stack in my local job market (Greece), where .NET Framework is super prevalent, majorly used by classic companies that don't even give you a fair technical chance if you lack a degree, and the devs are considered to be a cost center. I really, REALLY wish I was in another timeline where I could say in an intervi…

> I really, REALLY wish I was in another timeline where I could say in an interview "yes, I use Linux on my desktop and Rider for my IDE" without being seen as a traveler from outer space.

Could you please elaborate? Are you referring to most .NET shops not straying away from Windowsland?

Re: .NET 10

#95

Post by netdevphoenix »

sfn42 wrote: post #40
vintagedave wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

.Net is also good as a platform for other languages. I recently started working with RemObjects, and you can compile languages like Java, Swift, Go and more (VB, Pascal) to .Net. Then, the whole framework and ecosystem is available. I'm liking it a lot. They have customers who are startups and the 'got to have tools' folk like having lots of languages since they can onboard people who know anything-not-C# and benefit…

> they can onboard people who know anything-not-C# and benefit from the .Net library I don't get this mindset. I'd much rather have the new guy spend a few months getting used to a new language, than have an organization where everyone uses different languages. It's a nightmare a few years down the road when you have 20 different projects in 15 different languages and the people who built them are mostly gone. People…

> People love to talk about the right tool for the job, it's all BS

This sounds very close minded to me. It is certainly true that there exist tasks if not subdomains where some ecosystems are better than others. Using a hammer for everything might work for you if all your problems are nails. But that doesn't mean that all problems out there are nails

Re: .NET 10

#96

Post by mrsmrtss »

SparkBomb wrote: post #92
phillipcarter wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it though? Backends can be any language and there's a lot more variety there -- TS+node, Go, Python, Java. It's just .NET that's largely ignored for no real technical basis.

It really depends where you are. In the UK half the places seem to use .NET in some form or another. I am pretty language agnostic and I am reasonably competent programming in C# (I worked with C# and VB.NET for about 15 years), Go, Python, TypeScript and C++ these days. The issue with a lot of places that do C#/.NET stuff is that they will typically ignore new tech until it is officially blessed by Microsoft. You ca…

Why would they insist on using Visual Studio? At least you can run SQL Server easily on Linux using docker.

Re: .NET 10

#97

Post by defraudbah »

johannes1234321 wrote: post #90
charcircuit wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I mean the hot new areas for funding right now are AI and robotics Most developers are not in such startups. There is a lot of boring software out there which is a website. Even for AI, the first company that comes to mind OpenAI is known for ChatGPT, a web product. Most of the AI companies are building web products.

That is software with a web interface. Only a small part of OpenAI's work deals with web related things.

how dare you, i summon 10 js engineers from openai to downvote you (they have 6 only)

Re: .NET 10

#98

Post by SparkBomb »

starvar wrote: post #29
phillipcarter wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rider is your option there, it's better than Visual Studio (I used to work on VS).

How is it so different than Visual Studio that you think it is "better"?

I've used Rider for several years now on and off. Generally I would put these at the top of the list.

- Integrated ReSharper.

- Far better performance (it isn't even close)

- Doesn't take 30GB of disc space up. Visual Studio has been a massive disc space hog since forever. Rider is a few hundred megabytes IIRC.

- Less bugs (Visual Studio has been progressively getting worse).

- There was better tooling IMO around NuGET.

Re: .NET 10

#99

Post by kfuse »

Updated a pet project of mine and got a minor break:

  var pixels = new uint[renderers.width * renderers.height];
  var pixels2 = MemoryMarshal.Cast(pixels);
  pixels2[idx] = ...
In NET9.0 pixels2 were Span, but in NET10.0 a different MemoryMarshal.Cast overload is used and it is ReadOnlySpan now, so the assignment fails.

Spans is such a fundamental tool for low level programming. It is really unfortunate they were added relatively late to the language. Now every new version includes a slew of improvements related to them but they will never be as good as if they were there from the start or at least as early as generics were.

Re: .NET 10

#100

Post by pizza-wizard »

azertify wrote: post #89
madarcho wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is this worry coming from? (I'm curious, not shutting it down) I might be biased from having worked with production F#, but it feels more like functional is making its way into C#, as the general industry sees value in functional principles. So F# feels like its more here to stay?

Doesn't it feel like the functional stuff is coming into C# so that F# can disappear? Pure speculation on my part but doesn't seem unreasonable.

Microsoft is still supporting VB.NET, Windows Forms/WPF, and to a lesser extent VBA. I doubt F# is going away anytime soon.
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