Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups • Hacker News Board

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#91

Post by nitrogen » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:53 AM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #70

underwater wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Tesla site shows the locations. They look to have one in each city, but its not as big of an issue as your make out. The only need to make them convenient for travelers. Locals can always charge at home. That's something you can't do with a gas-powered car.

> Locals can always charge at home. In which case you're just pushing the negative environmental effects to the power plant.

Power plants, even coal-fired plants, are cleaner than burning gasoline in an internal combustion engine.

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#92

Post by rayiner » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:54 AM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #51

Come on, 30 minutes for a charge that'll get you just 180 miles? I just checked the 2012 Honda Civic specs[0], you can fill up with 13.2 gallons in 2 or 3 minutes, and that'll get you 13.2*32 mpg combined = 422 miles. There's no way this is gonna work unless the charging process is much faster or they swap batteries instead. 0: http://www.edmunds.com/honda/civic/2012/road-test-specs.html

Can you fuel your Honda Civic at home while you sleep?

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#93

Post by zevyoura » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:54 AM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #70

underwater wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Tesla site shows the locations. They look to have one in each city, but its not as big of an issue as your make out. The only need to make them convenient for travelers. Locals can always charge at home. That's something you can't do with a gas-powered car.

> Locals can always charge at home. In which case you're just pushing the negative environmental effects to the power plant.

...which is still vastly more efficient than an internal combustion engine.

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#94

Post by sliverstorm » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:54 AM UTC

evride wrote: post #83

brc wrote: post #29

Personally, I get annoyed when a company takes an existing term with a defined definition, and then decides to change the meaning. A supercharger is a mechanically driven air compressor which forces air into an engine. For a car company to take that name and redefine it into a marketing effort, well, it's annoying. Kind of like those 'turbo' buttons that used to be on the front of a PC.

Maybe they should have called the 'original' supercharger a "mechanical air compressor" instead of supercharger since the connection between the term and the definition is pretty weak, while Tesla's supercharger is an actual charger that charges more quickly than your average charger... making it 'super.'

Maybe they had more reason to call it a supercharger than you think. Supporting evidence-

A turbocharger, or turbo (colloquialism), from the Greek "τύρβη" (mixing/spinning)

Turbochargers were originally known as a turbosuperchargers when all forced induction devices were classified as superchargers

-- Wikipedia

In other words, the turbocharger was actually the origin of the concept of "turbo" meaning boosted speed/power.

I'm still looking for the origin of the "super" part.

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#95

Post by njharman » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:56 AM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #70

underwater wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Tesla site shows the locations. They look to have one in each city, but its not as big of an issue as your make out. The only need to make them convenient for travelers. Locals can always charge at home. That's something you can't do with a gas-powered car.

> Locals can always charge at home. In which case you're just pushing the negative environmental effects to the power plant.

> . Until it's cheaper and/or more convenient for him than gas cars, he won't switch.

You keep changing your argument. It's fuckload more convient to almost never have to go to the gas station, change oil, coolant, transmission fluid. Fuckload cheaper too.

Fail, go back to troll school.

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#96

Post by lgbr » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:57 AM UTC

w1ntermute wrote: post #71

ericd wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Day to day it is already more convenient, because you charge mostly at home - you never have to go to the gas station in the first place. It's pretty rare that I have to drive more than 100 miles in a day, and when I do, I'm really happy to stop for half an hour here and there to stretch my legs.

> because you charge mostly at home One of Musk's arguments for the supercharger was that it doesn't use non-renewable sources of energy. If you're charging at home, you're doing just that, since you're relying on the power plant for energy.

> If you're charging at home, you're doing just that, since you're relying on the power plant for energy.

Not necessarily. In Seattle, where solar is less effective, the electricity comes from almost entirely hydroelectric, with a little wind and a little nuclear.

Source: http://www.seattle.gov/light/fuelmix/

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#97

Post by tdfx » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:57 AM UTC

Danieru wrote: post #74

alexholehouse wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember talking to a friend who worked for an oil company, who told me that the shops at gas stations actually make 2-3 times more than the revenue generated from the gas. If you were an oil company which dealt exclusively with the consumer (which of course non of them are) you would in fact be a catering business which sold gas on the side.

Slight pedantry note: revenue and earnings are not the same thing.

I think he had them backwards -- I've heard similar stories from others who own gas stations. Gas makes up a substantial portion of their revenue, but the margins are so thin that most of the profit comes from the food and retail services.

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#98

Post by ericd » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:57 AM UTC

surrealize wrote: post #89

ericd wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The interesting thing is that people will mainly be charging at home, though, and will never need to visit a charging station - the car will be topped up every morning when you leave for work. So the number of fillups needing to be done at a station should be much lower. But an interesting point otherwise! I'd guess that the marginal cost of the plugs is low enough that it's feasible, though.

Right, I guess I should have said, replacing a mid-long-haul gas station (like the kettleman city one) would be a substantial effort. If this type of electric car becomes a mass-market thing, there would be less of a need for gas stations near home (as you say). But the number of cars needing fill-ups on long haul routes would be just as large, so the gas stations on those routes would have to be much larger if the o…

Ah yeah, you're right in that case. I am curious to see how that will be handled, it could create some nasty demand spikes during busy times (especially around holidays). It's not a big problem to put a bunch of plugs, I imagine, but it would take some serious power hardware to handle all of those, and the electricity infrastructure in general probably isn't ready yet for that kind of localized beating. But when we need it, we'll make it work.

EDIT: Actually, even more interestingly, I wonder if this will get people to synch up their long-distance travel plans - ie everyone will plan to leave such that they're running low around lunchtime so that they can stop and eat while they're charging. This could create big traffic jams...

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#99

Post by sbierwagen » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:58 AM UTC

[deleted] wrote: post #87

sbierwagen wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The connector on the vehicle is proprietary, but there's an OEM adapter to use SAE J1772 connectors. (like the charging station near Google Kirkland: http://tmblr.co/ZStnmwKlXAF8 )

[deleted]

Yes, the J1772 connector has a data pin. The Tesla Roadster can negotiate charge rate: http://www.teslamotors.com/roadster/charging/j1772-mobile-co...

Re: Tesla reveals Supercharger network, Free Fill Ups

#100

Post by danenania » Tue, Sep 25, 2012, 5:59 AM UTC

svmegatron wrote: post #37

If these become as popular as they seem like they should, I foresee long lines at the supercharging stations. I'm sure that 1. Tesla have thought of it and 2. They will milk the positive publicity from such an occurrence, but it could still be a PITA for, eg., folks who want to get home from Vegas.

It doesn't seem like there would be much barrier to simply adding more charging outlets if needed, would there?