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Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

ruby-lang.org

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Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#91

Post by shevy-java »

gcr wrote: post #51
byroot wrote: post #19

Ruby Central side: https://rubycentral.org/news/ruby-central-statement-on-rubyg...

For context, also check out their previous statement from September 19, which also "reflects our shared commitment to the long-term stability and growth of the Ruby ecosystem" [sic]: https://rubycentral.org/news/strengthening-the-stewardship-o...

They keep on using buzzwords. These Ruby central guys never maintained a single gem used by many people in their life. I have no idea what they are writing, but it feels as if AI is writing their statements. Even then it is of such a poor, repetitive quality that even AI may just accidentally write better "summaries". People lost all trust in Ruby Central - there is no way for them to win back trust here.

IMO it would be better to start from a clean slate; dissolve Ruby Central and bring back the community with a new policy, rules - but that's not going to happen. Ruby Central went the corporate way and that's it. It would just be ironic if, say in 10 years, gem.coop proves to be much more successful whereas Ruby Central still writes the same AI-generated text ("we care for the community even if everyone is now elsewhere already").

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#92

Post by dismalaf »

shevy-java wrote: post #77
white-moss wrote: post #10

Really appreciate Matz stepping up to take on this difficult situation. As a Japanese developer, I’ve been worried about the direction things were going, so it’s reassuring to see this.

Stepping up how? It was always clear that Hiroshi Shibata didn't act solo without approval. I am not saying he knew the outcome before that, but WHEN was the decision made to take over gems + bundler? I have a slight suspicion that this may have been decided upon months ago already. > As a Japanese developer, I’ve been worried about the direction things were going, so it’s reassuring to see this. I am actually much m…

> I am actually much more worried now

Why? Japanese culture is more conservative, less prone to knee jerk decisions, and Ruby is their biggest home grown programming language.

I'm also not American nor Japanese and I think this is the best possible outcome.

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#93

Post by shevy-java »

gcr wrote: post #48
gardnr wrote: post #40

Can anyone please explain this in simple terms for a relative outsider?

See this thread for context: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45299170#45300774 See especially Mike McQuaid's summaries. He did a bunch of mediation and comms work to make the situation digestible to outsiders. Check his recent posts (at time of writing) on https://bsky.app/profile/mikemcquaid.com

Yeah. I think everyone on all sides praises Mike for his effort. Cool guy.

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#95

Post by busterarm »

brightball wrote: post #83
itsnowandnever wrote: post #31

this is good and I hope this puts a lot of the drama in the rearview mirror. younger developers coming across Ruby must be like "wtf" about this situation. very peculiar to have these projects so politicised and I say that to the people that "try and keep politics out" (DHH) more than anyone. making your politics known and then being like "but you're not allowed to have an opinion on it" is't cute or clever. it's chi…

He's also in a bit of a unique situation because of his public political profile was essentially forced. - Politics at work were becoming a huge problem at 37Signals - They asked that politics be kept out of company chats, but encouraged people to be political active on non-work channels/social media/etc even during work hours - People lost their minds at this incredibly reasonable request which then blew up on the i…

Good summary. Also the ask for politics to be kept out of company chats is often what I find cited as the _core_ reason for why "DHH is a Nazi" in online discussions. It's _weird_.

I think the real root of peoples' disagreement over what happened there is that rank-and-file employees wanted to assert a lot more control over what their company does than they actually could and they were informed that that wouldn't be acceptable. The six month severance was generous.

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#96

Post by shevy-java »

joshmn wrote: post #46

This is the only outcome that anyone who touches ruby cannot be upset with.

How so?

I think there are a gazillion questions left. But, I also agree that the future will tell, e. g. we'll have to see how popular gem.coop will become (if they become popular). And I also, despite my disagreements, think that it may have been better to solve installations of ruby projects from the get go, e. g. Rust + cargo. But I also see this as separate from a service such as rubygems.org (or whoever provides any infrastructure). The question of who develops functionality can be separate, I have no strong preference here. And, I also agree that having both bin/gem and bin/bundle is not good. There should be a unified API (or two - a simple one maintained by ruby core, and then people can build extra functionality into their own variants).

Sadly this all also may end up like this:

https://xkcd.com/927/

What I liked about bin/gem was its simplicity. Bundler brought a few new things or easier things to the table. "gem" should make it much easier to use any source though, including gem.coop.

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#97

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

bmacho wrote: post #37
the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So it’s okay for Matz to get HSBT to steal people’s open source projects? Where is the theft? The projects were open source, they are still open source.

The software is open source, not the project. The name is not for the taking. You can download the code, modify and release it, but you can't just claim ownership over a product.

That is a question of trademark law and a much more complex topic. Many people contributed over the years.

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#98

Post by xg19837 »

shevy-java wrote: post #77
white-moss wrote: post #10

Really appreciate Matz stepping up to take on this difficult situation. As a Japanese developer, I’ve been worried about the direction things were going, so it’s reassuring to see this.

Stepping up how? It was always clear that Hiroshi Shibata didn't act solo without approval. I am not saying he knew the outcome before that, but WHEN was the decision made to take over gems + bundler? I have a slight suspicion that this may have been decided upon months ago already. > As a Japanese developer, I’ve been worried about the direction things were going, so it’s reassuring to see this. I am actually much m…

Yes. At least Ruby was always strongly Japanese though. In Python European and Asian developers are overtly exploited, with U.S. corporations and their employed stooges holding the reins of power.

I'm considering switching to Erlang, which was developed at a corporation from the start and appears to be drama and cancel free.

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#99

Post by claudiug »

joeldrapper wrote: post #4

These projects were not Ruby Central’s in the first place. They were stolen for Ruby Central by a Ruby Core insider, HSBT. This is horrible news. They were stolen from André Arko, Colby Swandale, David Rodríguez, Ellen, Josef Šimánek, Martin Emde and Samuel Giddins.

[flagged]

Re: Ruby core team takes ownership of RubyGems and Bundler

#100

Post by shevy-java »

dismalaf wrote: post #58

This makes sense, considering Gem and Bundler are shipped with Ruby.

Well - I'd actually argue that it would be better and simpler if there would be just one binary. How it is called is IMO secondary. It would be better if the whole API would be unified. Bundler came later though.
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