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Deep Zionism

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Re: Deep Zionism

#91

Post by richardfeynman »

dttze wrote: post #90
richardfeynman wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, I can see we're straying from a discussion of facts to a discussion of what people said, which is not productive. I'm glad you now know that there were >500,000 exits per year from Gaza to Israel and Egypt in 2022, and don't dispute that figure. You're reduced now to accepting that figure, and trying to find a large and arbitrary number to divide it by. Fine by me. Whatever you divide it by, there were logged e…

>For my own part, I used to lead pro-palestine rallies, and at the beginning of the war I even paid to help smuggle a Gazan out through one of the Rafah crossings No you didn’t. Or you’re saying you cared enough to hold rallies but now you just so happened to have developed “skepticism” once Israel started the genocide. And now you parrot hasbara talking points. Yeah nah.

What do you know? I have pictures for proof. I've been involved in the movement since 2002.

Re: Deep Zionism

#92

Post by richardfeynman »

dttze wrote: post #90
richardfeynman wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, I can see we're straying from a discussion of facts to a discussion of what people said, which is not productive. I'm glad you now know that there were >500,000 exits per year from Gaza to Israel and Egypt in 2022, and don't dispute that figure. You're reduced now to accepting that figure, and trying to find a large and arbitrary number to divide it by. Fine by me. Whatever you divide it by, there were logged e…

>For my own part, I used to lead pro-palestine rallies, and at the beginning of the war I even paid to help smuggle a Gazan out through one of the Rafah crossings No you didn’t. Or you’re saying you cared enough to hold rallies but now you just so happened to have developed “skepticism” once Israel started the genocide. And now you parrot hasbara talking points. Yeah nah.

also, they're not Israeli taking points, they're facts.

Re: Deep Zionism

#93

Post by richardfeynman »

dttze wrote: post #87
richardfeynman wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not forget the rest of the quote; I omitted it because it turns out that was wrong. Tunnels existed from Rafah to Egypt right up to 10/7. There are videos of Egyptian and israeli authorities destroying them post 10/7.

You deliberately left it out because it invalidated your point. Even if Israel wasn’t lying about tunnels, they weren’t moving the amount of people you claimed. So your point was bogus.

What do you mean? There is photographic and video evidence of Israel destroying the tunnels after it established the Philadelphia corridor. CGI?

Also, let's pretend the tunnels didn't exist (they did). How in the world would that invalidate my point that Gaza wasn't an open air prison because there were more than 500k documented exits in 2022?

Re: Deep Zionism

#94

Post by dragonwriter »

dttze wrote: post #90
richardfeynman wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, I can see we're straying from a discussion of facts to a discussion of what people said, which is not productive. I'm glad you now know that there were >500,000 exits per year from Gaza to Israel and Egypt in 2022, and don't dispute that figure. You're reduced now to accepting that figure, and trying to find a large and arbitrary number to divide it by. Fine by me. Whatever you divide it by, there were logged e…

>For my own part, I used to lead pro-palestine rallies, and at the beginning of the war I even paid to help smuggle a Gazan out through one of the Rafah crossings No you didn’t. Or you’re saying you cared enough to hold rallies but now you just so happened to have developed “skepticism” once Israel started the genocide. And now you parrot hasbara talking points. Yeah nah.

> once Israel started the genocide

Israel started the genocide not later than 1968. Pretending that the genocide is a novel phenomenon starting after the Oct. 7 attacks is a propaganda point actively pushed by those under the sway of Iranian propaganda that is designed to align with and subtly reinforce, among those not already aligned with the Palestinian cause, Israeli propaganda that what is described as genocide is a response to the Oct. 7 attacks, because Iran's interest is not in ending the genocide, but in ensuring that it continues while leveraging it for propaganda cover for its own geopolitical interests in the region.

Re: Deep Zionism

#95

Post by chaps »

richardfeynman wrote: post #79
konmok wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think @chaps was quite justified in defining "mention", given that you just talked about 10/7 and then immediately insisted you never mentioned 10/7. That suggests that you either don't know what "mention" means, or you don't take any care with your words. And if you aren't being careful with your words, why should we trust them?

Yes, of course you think that, but it's also rather silly. I said "prior to 10/7", to point out that people claimed there was an open-air prison before that date. I wasn't talking about the attacks; I was talking about before the attacks. Do you want me to define "prior" for you?

I think your anger is clouding your interpretation of words and intent of words. Chill, friend.

Re: Deep Zionism

#96

Post by dttze »

richardfeynman wrote: post #91
dttze wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>For my own part, I used to lead pro-palestine rallies, and at the beginning of the war I even paid to help smuggle a Gazan out through one of the Rafah crossings No you didn’t. Or you’re saying you cared enough to hold rallies but now you just so happened to have developed “skepticism” once Israel started the genocide. And now you parrot hasbara talking points. Yeah nah.

What do you know? I have pictures for proof. I've been involved in the movement since 2002.

Post them then

Re: Deep Zionism

#97

Post by breppp »

msgodel wrote: post #64
breppp wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Did the Nazi homocaust of Jews seek to destroy all Jewish people, no. The entire goal of the holocaust was destroying all Jewish people (and many who weren't). This was exactly why this was dubbed "The final solution to the jewish problem". You might want to educate yourself a bit more on the subject > The whole world, outside of the US (thanks AIPAC!) and maybe the UK is convinced that Israeli atrocities on Palest…

[flagged]

[flagged]

Re: Deep Zionism

#98

Post by breppp »

DaveZale wrote: post #41
breppp wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Did the Nazi homocaust of Jews seek to destroy all Jewish people, no. The entire goal of the holocaust was destroying all Jewish people (and many who weren't). This was exactly why this was dubbed "The final solution to the jewish problem". You might want to educate yourself a bit more on the subject > The whole world, outside of the US (thanks AIPAC!) and maybe the UK is convinced that Israeli atrocities on Palest…

Well what are your thoughts on reducing Gaza to rubble? On forced starvation and repeated forced relocation of Palestinians? On killing called "mowing the lawn" by Israelis? On expanding Israeli terrority to include the property of neighboring countries and calling it "Greater Israel" ???? Where do the Zionists (many who are athiests) plan to stop, if ever? Does Netanyahu refrain from peace agreements simply to remai…

My thoughts are that when Hamas kidnapped 200 Israeli citizens including babies and massacred a 1000 more, which included mass rapes, beheading and burnings, there was no choice left to Israel but to remove that organization completely.

Because Hamas as the governing political party in Gaza, decided to use all of their resources to build fortifications below civilian neighborhoods, this endeavour entails the destruction of entire Gazan neighborhoods. Not unlike the Battle of Berlin or the bombings of Dresden.

It's cliche to say war is terrible, but it is, that's why you don't start one, and that's why Israel always tried to do quick operations which amounted to nothing ('mowing the lawn' as you incorrectly quoted out of context). An advice Gazans have surely needed.

If you finally do start a war, you should really start a war you have a chance at winning. If even that isn't true, at the very least you don't go on such a barbaric rampage making your enemy extremely determined at removing your force completely, at great expense at your civilian population which elected you

Regarding starvation in Gaza, due to racism, media rage bating and general long cultural tradition in the west to scape goat a certain ethnicity, the perception is far different than reality. For example, a recent Gazan instagram account:

https://www.instagram.com/moh_z_co

Re: Deep Zionism

#99

Post by richardfeynman »

chaps wrote: post #95
richardfeynman wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, of course you think that, but it's also rather silly. I said "prior to 10/7", to point out that people claimed there was an open-air prison before that date. I wasn't talking about the attacks; I was talking about before the attacks. Do you want me to define "prior" for you?

I think your anger is clouding your interpretation of words and intent of words. Chill, friend.

I'm not angry.

Re: Deep Zionism

#100

Post by richardfeynman »

dragonwriter wrote: post #94
dttze wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>For my own part, I used to lead pro-palestine rallies, and at the beginning of the war I even paid to help smuggle a Gazan out through one of the Rafah crossings No you didn’t. Or you’re saying you cared enough to hold rallies but now you just so happened to have developed “skepticism” once Israel started the genocide. And now you parrot hasbara talking points. Yeah nah.

> once Israel started the genocide Israel started the genocide not later than 1968. Pretending that the genocide is a novel phenomenon starting after the Oct. 7 attacks is a propaganda point actively pushed by those under the sway of Iranian propaganda that is designed to align with and subtly reinforce, among those not already aligned with the Palestinian cause, Israeli propaganda that what is described as genocide…

Hahaha, Google a population chart of Palestinians since 1968. It's been one of the fastest growing populations in the world. Some genocide.
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