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Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

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Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#91

Post by HAL3000 »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #75

It's going to be fun in two years when Intel is golden child again because TSMC has bomb damage and Taiwan is blockaded.

> TSMC has bomb damage and Taiwan is blockaded

For anyone familiar with Chinese culture, history, and mindset, and who views China through that lens rather than a Western one, the probability of this is lower than the probability of Intel’s collapsing entirely in the next two years.

“Supreme excellence is to subdue the enemy without fighting.”

“Victory without unsheathing the blade.”

“If swords are clashing, strategy has already failed.”

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#93

Post by mandevil »

nxobject wrote: post #33
YetAnotherNick wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Specially companies like Nvidia for which the gross profit margin is so high their risk of losing TSMC is higher than risk of losing money.

Apple is similarly paranoid about single-sourcing -- off the top of my head I'm not sure whether their top-end M-class chips are currently fabbed by both TSMC and Samsung, or just TSMC>

Samsung has already announced that their frontier node (what they call 1.4nm) is going to delayed at least two years, and issuing statements calling it into question at all. Intel has announced that they will only do what they call 14A if they can get a partner who will promise to use it in significant volume.

As of this moment, the only company that is definitely going ahead with that next generation node is TSMC. The other two companies capable of doing so are both signalling that they will only do it if they get a partner who promises to use them for significant volume, not just as negotiating leverage against TSMC.

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#94

Post by mrguyorama »

HAL3000 wrote: post #91
2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #75

It's going to be fun in two years when Intel is golden child again because TSMC has bomb damage and Taiwan is blockaded.

> TSMC has bomb damage and Taiwan is blockaded For anyone familiar with Chinese culture, history, and mindset, and who views China through that lens rather than a Western one, the probability of this is lower than the probability of Intel’s collapsing entirely in the next two years. “Supreme excellence is to subdue the enemy without fighting.” “Victory without unsheathing the blade.” “If swords are clashing, strategy…

China is building rather innovative invasion barges.

Their plan is to invade. Or at least, that's a plan they are spending significant resources on because it's in the top five plans.

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#96

Post by epolanski »

close04 wrote: post #65
epolanski wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech hardware is a cutthroat business, tech companies are gonna order at Intel if it has something that others don't on a business point of view: more performing, cheaper, faster delivery. The US government can wish and encourage all they want, as long as Samsung, TSMC and any other produces better chips for less, the money will flow there.

If a government finds a sector or company to have strategic importance they will not let it die. The rest is free-market absolutism that never comes to be. I believe today more than ever the US considers Intel to be of strategic importance. > the money will flow there Which money? The CHIPS act [0] isn't only for the ones who produce "better chips for less". [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CHIPS_and_Science_Act

The fact that US taxpayers will subsidize Intel does not mean that Nvidia, Google, AMD, etc are gonna other their chips there.

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#97

Post by jonbiggums22 »

Havoc wrote: post #95

I really hope they manage to pull something out of the hat here. Own a bunch of AMD shares so cheering for them naturally...but we don't need a monopoly in CPU space.

It would be bad for x86 in general if Intel just disappears. They supply a ton of chips for businesses still and TSMC isn't going to replace that overnight.

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#98

Post by mbajkowski »

amelius wrote: post #44
nxobject wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is similarly paranoid about single-sourcing -- off the top of my head I'm not sure whether their top-end M-class chips are currently fabbed by both TSMC and Samsung, or just TSMC>

Because if there was only a single source (for example if the other one was out-competed), they'd have to pay 30% of their revenue for the privilege of being in the FabStore.

This is already happening. The leading edge node wafers cost a fortune compared to older nodes. TSMC has limited capacity, as it takes years to bring new fabs online, and with competitors struggling they have great pricing power. Maybe why their revenue has roughly tripled over the last decade.

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#99

Post by toasterlovin »

dannyw wrote: post #81
toxic72 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably the Intel CPUs in Macbooks before Apple made the push for the M1 - circa the Intel quad core era where their laptop chips had major heat issues... ~2012 IIRC?

I’m not defending Intel here, but those Intel MacBooks never had appropriate thermal design or headroom for the processor’s operating specs.

I think the theory is that they had an appropriate thermal design for cpus which were supposed to ship but never did.

Re: Intel Foundry demonstrates first Arm-based chip on 18a node

#100

Post by toasterlovin »

roboror wrote: post #54
blackoil wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple, Nvidia and US govt can provide the required funds if they have confidence in its ability to deliver. These companies will benefit from breaking current monopoly of TSMC.

Yep, that's exactly what they did with TSMC. Foundries don't just build massive production lines and hope someone will use them, even TSMC.

Yeah, everyone is focused on TSMC as the company with the secret sauce, but really it’s Apple. Whichever foundry Apple goes with gets the majority of leading edge transistor volume.
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