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12ft.io Taken Down

newsmediaalliance.org

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Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#91

Post by jlarocco »

piva00 wrote: post #63
0x5FC3 wrote: post #3

We all hate adverts, some of us don't like or can't pay. Those who pay, have access to a few publications they enjoy. It would be absurd to pay for all the publications, all the streaming services, but we don't want monopolies either. What could be a solution for this madness?

It's one space where I think some form of microtransaction (in the sub-cents USD) could work: I want to pay per article, not have yet another subscription in the 5-15 USD just because an article interested me. Media consumption habits changed a lot in the Internet-era, we read articles from many different publications, and only very few of those are of interest enough for someone to spend that amount per month. Inste…

I think that argument is begging the question.

Media consumption habits changed because that's how the internet was foisted on people - not necesarily because anybody made a choice or were asked what their preferences were.

After 30 years on the internet, I've gone full circle. I don't want (and won't) pay per article. 99% of the news articles I read come from a handful of trusted websites (a couple of major news outlets, a couple of local news outlets, etc.) and I don't have any problem subscribing to them. There's too much garbage on the internet, and I want the gatekeeping.

I guess that puts sites like HN in an awkward position, though. Some of the content posted here is interesting, but rarely enough that I would pay to read it on some random site. If it's important enough, it'll show up on one of the news sites I pay for.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#92

Post by lovelearning »

If this News Media Alliance put some effort into enabling per-article micropayments or a prepaid credits system valid across all its members, there'd be fewer people looking to bypass paywalls.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#93

Post by immibis »

Aurornis wrote: post #39
tyzoid wrote: post #25

The problem is there's not really a good way to subscribe to these things. I'd gladly pay a nominal fee (~$6 USD/mo) for access to media, but I'm not about to subscribe individually to each site. Ideally, I'd subscribe to a single service and payment is split across the various sites in proportion to how many articles I read from each site. There was a service that promised this a while back, but IIRC mozilla bought…

> I'd gladly pay a nominal fee (~6/mo) for access to media, but I'm not about to subscribe individually to each site. Ideally, I'd subscribe to a single service and payment is split across the various sites in proportion to how many articles I read from each site. How many sites would you end up splitting that across? For people who click a lot of links on Hacker News or other social media that could be a dozen or mo…

Yes? If they show me one page per year, they can get a few cents per year. That's how it works. If they want more money, they should produce more content worth viewing.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#94

Post by NicuCalcea »

m82labs wrote: post #80
0x5FC3 wrote: post #3

We all hate adverts, some of us don't like or can't pay. Those who pay, have access to a few publications they enjoy. It would be absurd to pay for all the publications, all the streaming services, but we don't want monopolies either. What could be a solution for this madness?

I want RSS with micropayments. I want to consume information in my own interface, and am willing to pay. I am not willing to pay for a full subscription to a publication when I only find a few articles a year that I want to read. I want Spotify for text, but with a business model that makes sense for all involved.

Micropayments have been tried plenty of times and never succeeded. People say they'd be willing to pay, but they're not.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#95

Post by NicuCalcea »

cwillu wrote: post #79
Workaccount2 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ABP, the original uBlock Origin, saw the writing on the wall a decade ago or whenever and tried to mediate a truce between users and advertisers. ABP would allow through ads that weren't egregious, and users could provide compensation for content they consumed. People however either can't read or can't comprehend the writing on the wall, so instead they rioted against ABP and moved to uBlock Origin. I know there are…

My computer belongs to me and will display the things I tell it to display. If ABP gets in the way of that, then so long ABP.

I'm fine with this approach as long as it goes both ways. The media organisation's server is theirs, and if they want to put up a paywall or block clients with ad blockers, that's their prerogative.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#96

Post by NicuCalcea »

robswc wrote: post #55

I think the biggest issue is the _vast_ majority of news is noise. It won't effect you. Maybe you could argue we should be "aware" of certain events happening but I'd argue most only complicate your life. I would subscribe to a local news provider but I see no reason to ever subscribe to a national news outlet.

As a journalist, I think you're absolutely right, I've met lots of people who clearly won't benefit from reading the news.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#97

Post by cwillu »

NicuCalcea wrote: post #95
cwillu wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My computer belongs to me and will display the things I tell it to display. If ABP gets in the way of that, then so long ABP.

I'm fine with this approach as long as it goes both ways. The media organisation's server is theirs, and if they want to put up a paywall or block clients with ad blockers, that's their prerogative.

At no point does ublock force their server to perform work it wouldn't otherwise. “Blocking clients with ad blockers” isn't a thing, there is only “send information plus instructions for the client to block itself”, and “only send information to logged in users” (and if they're incapable of choosing trustworthy users, that is not my problem).

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#98

Post by sn9 »

0x5FC3 wrote: post #3

We all hate adverts, some of us don't like or can't pay. Those who pay, have access to a few publications they enjoy. It would be absurd to pay for all the publications, all the streaming services, but we don't want monopolies either. What could be a solution for this madness?

I would be fine with ads if I could block anything that wasn't a simple static image with an obvious link that's off to the side. The software equivalent of what newspaper ads used to be.

Anything with sound or motion, or popups, or interrupts my reading or viewing, or something that notably worsens my user experience, or basically any usage of dark patterns . . . I will block with impunity.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#99

Post by NicuCalcea »

cwillu wrote: post #97
NicuCalcea wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm fine with this approach as long as it goes both ways. The media organisation's server is theirs, and if they want to put up a paywall or block clients with ad blockers, that's their prerogative.

At no point does ublock force their server to perform work it wouldn't otherwise. “Blocking clients with ad blockers” isn't a thing, there is only “send information plus instructions for the client to block itself”, and “only send information to logged in users” (and if they're incapable of choosing trustworthy users, that is not my problem).

I didn't say anything about the server doing extra work? And server-side ad insertion definitely exists, but if you want to get pedantic about the delivery mechanism, that's fine, websites have the right to bundle their content with ads and code that makes their ads more difficult to block.

Re: 12ft.io Taken Down

#100

Post by NicuCalcea »

PaulHoule wrote: post #87
vasco wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only long term solution is to stop sharing paywalled content.

The dirty secret is that the news media needs archive.today in order to function. Anyone writing an article about subject Y needs to know what every paper wrote about it. Back in the 00's it got out that you could log into almost any newspaper web site with "media/media", something that got clamped down on when it got out. You'd think The New York Times could afford to get a subscription to other newspapers for their…

Most newsrooms have access to LexisNexis or a similar service, so they have access to other paper's stories. My old newsroom also directly paid for subscriptions to other newspapers, it's not uncommon.
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