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RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

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Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#91

Post by t0bia_s »

orbital-decay wrote: post #67
t0bia_s wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because those open-source editors are made by coders, not photographers. Those tools you really need for properly edit raws are hidden in blated features (multiple demosaic algorithms) or completely missing (AI masking). And UI is not user friendly.

They are made by and for photographers. This software is designed for many use cases, not just creative photography - hence multiple demosaicing algorithms. AI masking is missing exactly because it's made by photographers - they don't have the required expertise. UI is not intuitive because a) it's designed by photographers' committee, not UI designers, and b) you are familiar with a completely different workflow.

Most photographers don't know how develop software at all.

Please explain why photographers need 20 differnet sharpening methods, 5 demosaicing algorithms, many colour corrections that are almost useles if AI masking is not present?

Coders often lost in all kind of geeky features that missing actual usability by targeted audience. Bloated software is not what I would expect from alternative to commercially used proprietary software.

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#92

Post by 999900000999 »

cybertimom wrote: post #29
bjelkeman-again wrote: post #5

Looks very interesting. How much work would it be to get this code signed for the Mac?

I think it's pretty simple. I'm just focused on the core features right now but I definitely plan to sign it in the next 1-2 weeks. Thanks :)

I wouldn't make the Apple Developer dance a priority unless you intend to sell a commercial signed version.

Few reasons.

1. It's 100$ a year, which isn't pocket change when it's making you no revenue.

2. Apple likes to randomly deny developer accounts.

3. They have no issue with outright rejecting apps with vague reasoning.

4. Plenty of high quality raw editing apps already exist for OSX.

If someone really wants to use it on OSX you've provided clear instructions.

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#93

Post by virtualritz »

igouy wrote: post #90
thrtythreeforty wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mostly prefer RawTherapee's processing, with one exception: Darktable's stupidly good "filmic" emulation can beautifully recover overexposed raws that I thought were trash. It manages to make it easy to shift the entire scene one or two stops darker with just a few clicks (yes, there is data up there in raws). I have not found an equivalent mechanism in RawTherapee. Does anyone know if it has an equivalent tool?

https://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/Exposure#Highlight_Reconstr...

Parent was not talking about highlight reconstruction.

DT has a highlight reconstruction module too but RTs was superior every time I tried.

They're talking about the Filmic module which is a fancy exposure adjustment curve. I ported it to Rust for use in our internal 2D compositing renderer (not open, unfortunately). That's when I got to appreciate the work done there, really.

The gainforge crate has another port, although not with all parameters of the original algorithm, AFAIR.

The algorithm is explained in a blog post by the author of the module. [1]

Who is btw. the same guy that got fed up with DT dev and forked it to Ansel.

[1] https://eng.aurelienpierre.com/2018/11/filmic-darktable-and-...

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#94

Post by CharlesW »

josephg wrote: post #79
simonmales wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Partner is getting into photography and I don't have the stomach to purchase some software. I threw darktable and rawtherapee on the table but without technical grit you get nowhere really fast. It's no my wheelhouse so they are mostly in there own.

I've been getting into photography lately too and running into the same question. There's no way I'm getting an adobe subscription. But I'm not sure what tools do I want to pick up instead. Apple Photos has gotten me pretty far, but I'm hitting the limits of what it can do. And my photo library is getting pretty big now - big enough that I want some software to manage where my photos live as well.

> But I'm not sure what tools do I want to pick up instead. Apple Photos has gotten me pretty far, but I'm hitting the limits of what it can do.

Be sure to take a close look at Nitro, created by a former Apple lead of Apple's Aperture, iPhoto, RAW Camera and Core Image engineering teams: https://www.gentlemencoders.com/nitro-for-macos/index.html

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#95

Post by igouy »

strogonoff wrote: post #65
Mashimo wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the same approach. I really like "easy to use, hard to master" tools in general. If you look at CaptureOne you can see how easy it is to edit a raw image. Most of the time it looks like the camera jpeg without having to tune anything. But then you have the options to go in depth. Sometimes I have a photo session where everything is to my liking, just a bit of exposure and crop. Other times I shoot in night clu…

This tracks with my RawTherapee experience. I copy in base settings corresponding to the camera and the lens and then make tweaks. After a while often one of the pre-made profiles is good enough.

For example — Adobe\CameraRaw Sony SLT-A65 Adobe Standard.dcp ?

    DCP Tone curve
    DCP Base table
    DCP Look table

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#96

Post by orbital-decay »

t0bia_s wrote: post #91
orbital-decay wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are made by and for photographers. This software is designed for many use cases, not just creative photography - hence multiple demosaicing algorithms. AI masking is missing exactly because it's made by photographers - they don't have the required expertise. UI is not intuitive because a) it's designed by photographers' committee, not UI designers, and b) you are familiar with a completely different workflow.

Most photographers don't know how develop software at all. Please explain why photographers need 20 differnet sharpening methods, 5 demosaicing algorithms, many colour corrections that are almost useles if AI masking is not present? Coders often lost in all kind of geeky features that missing actual usability by targeted audience. Bloated software is not what I would expect from alternative to commercially used propr…

Because it's not necessarily about creative/artistic photography, it's also for things like e.g. microscopy or negative or scan processing, and it's not an alternative to Lightroom which does "magic" unacceptable in many technical use cases.

You can ignore features that aren't made for you, and actually I think they're mostly hidden by default in DT (make a preset if you don't like the default tool selection). All these features were added because somebody needed them at some point, the DT/RT/ART communities are chaotic and lack vision but they're actually using their stuff.

>Coders

As I said, this is not software made by coders for coders. This is exactly how the software made by photographers would look if they lacked organization, focus, and UX skills. If it was made by coders (and UI designers), it would probably have looked like Lightroom and had AI selection.

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#97

Post by igouy »

inferiorhuman wrote: post #72
strogonoff wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, let me concur that Darktable is not great. I found it to be neither quite as simple as Lightroom, nor as powerful as RawTherapee, and severely lacking in documentation. > Another dealt with trying to set color temperature. There are two places color temperature can be set and they'll both conflict with each other. There are at least three colour temperature / white balance controls in RT; more if you count out…

The problems I listed were for Darktable. If you use the stock configuration and go into the "white balance" module you will get an error. If memory serves turning off the "white balance" module also leads to problems. Instead you're expected to go into the "color calibration" module. More powerful? Perhaps. Unnecessarily obtuse? Absolutely. I tried Rawtherapee first as they actually sign their (macOS) app. Unfortuna…

I wonder specifically what you mean by "too unstable" and how long ago that was, because I haven't had problems with RawTherapee on MSWin.

(Later versions may have moved newer functionality to a different tab or menu item, is that what you mean?)

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#98

Post by igouy »

virtualritz wrote: post #93
igouy wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/Exposure#Highlight_Reconstr...

Parent was not talking about highlight reconstruction. DT has a highlight reconstruction module too but RTs was superior every time I tried. They're talking about the Filmic module which is a fancy exposure adjustment curve. I ported it to Rust for use in our internal 2D compositing renderer (not open, unfortunately). That's when I got to appreciate the work done there, really. The gainforge crate has another port, a…

Thanks for the correction. After reading the reference I don't feel the need to pursue what seems a bit like a quest.

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#99

Post by daturkel »

Nergg wrote: post #50
inferiorhuman wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about not "feeling right at home". I've detailed this in other comments but it's just that DT has an abysmal interface and that the devs insist that it needs to be complex. This sort of hostile attitude is part of what spawned Ansel. I much prefer the control darktable gives me now. This is a bit of a myth. One of my complaints dealt with how unintuitive the sliders are. There's no additional control gained…

I try to daily drive Linux but can't find a simple / nice to use RAW editor. I had high hopes for Darktable but I was astonished how bad the GUI is. When trying to delete photo, it deletes the photo under the pointer, not the photo I selected... WTF ?!? And the whole app feels so complicated... Then there's forks emerging and the dev forces are diluted in multiples applications and Adobe continues to milk its users b…

That insane behavior around acting on the highlighted image instead of the selected image has finally been fixed: https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/issues/16850#issu...

Re: RapidRAW: A non-destructive and GPU-accelerated RAW image editor

#100

Post by igouy »

strogonoff wrote: post #51
Sharlin wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a case of diminishing returns. Shooting raw is a huge and obvious improvement if you want to post-process in almost any way. Conditional on that the workflow should be as smooth and simple as possible. Abstract controls like "clarity" are fine if the result of adjusting them is tangible and almost always does what you want. Giving the user lots of knobs that hardly have a visible effect (let alone a desired effe…

> Shooting raw is a huhe and obvious improvement if you want to post-process in almost any way. See, you are saying “want to post-process”, which to me says that there is a different priority present rather than just “simplicity and ease of use”. If the priority is “making the photos look the way you want them to look”, then we are in a territory where it is not as simple as “this tool is easy to use and therefore a…

When is the priority not “making the photos look the way you want them to look” ?

When you say “simplicity and ease of use” I think that includes taking the photos, and if I can defer some decisions that might make the overall process simpler.

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