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Local-first software (2019)

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Re: Local-first software (2019)

#91

Post by nofunsir »

criddell wrote: post #71
DataDaoDe wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure you could. I'm not, I don't think its in the spirit of local first. And I wouldn't pay money for that, but if you or someone else wants to build that kind of software - its a free world :)

It’s easy to say you wouldn’t do that, but if it gets to the point where you have an employee helping you out and in a downturn you have to choose between laying them off or pushing an ad to keep paying them one more quarter, you might reconsider.

No, ads aren't the solution for everything, and in my opinion anything.

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#92

Post by maxhille »

DataDaoDe wrote: post #29

Yes a thousand percent! I'm working on this too. I'm sick of everyone trying to come up with a use case to get all my data in everyone's cloud so I have to pay a subscription fee to just make things work. I'm working on a fitness tracking app right now that will use the sublime model - just buy it, get updates for X years, sync with all your devices and use it forever. If you want updates after X years buy the newest…

How do you plan to do the syncing without some sort of cloud infrastructure?

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#93

Post by GMoromisato »

al_borland wrote: post #44
GMoromisato wrote: post #24

Personally, I disagree with this approach. This is trying to solve a business problem (I can't trust cloud-providers) with a technical trade-off (avoid centralized architecture). The problems with closed-source software (lack of control, lack of reliability) were solved with a new business model: open source development, which came with new licenses and new ways of getting revenue (maintenance contracts instead of li…

Does this really solve the problem? Let's say I'm using a cloud provider for some service I enjoy. They have documents that spell out that if they have to close their doors they will give X months of notice and allow for a data export. Ok, great. Now they decide to shut their doors and honor those agreements. What am I left with? A giant JSON file that is effectively useless unless I decide to write my own app, or so…

Data portability is, I think, useful even before the service shuts down. If I'm using some Google cloud-service and I can easily move all my data to a competing service, then there will be competition for my business.

What if cloud platforms were more like brokerage firms? I can move my stocks from UBS to Fidelity by filling out a few forms and everything moves (somewhat) seamlessly.

My data should be the same way. I should be able to move all my data out of Google and move it to Microsoft with a few clicks without losing any documents or even my folder hierarchy. [Disclaimer: Maybe this is possible already and I'm just out of the loop. If so, though, extend to all SaaS vendors and all data.]

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#94

Post by echelon »

DataDaoDe wrote: post #29

Yes a thousand percent! I'm working on this too. I'm sick of everyone trying to come up with a use case to get all my data in everyone's cloud so I have to pay a subscription fee to just make things work. I'm working on a fitness tracking app right now that will use the sublime model - just buy it, get updates for X years, sync with all your devices and use it forever. If you want updates after X years buy the newest…

> I'm sick of everyone trying to come up with a use case to get all my data in everyone's cloud so I have to pay a subscription fee to just make things work.

AI photo and video generation is impractical to run locally.

ComfyUI and Flux exist, but they serve a tiny sliver of the market with very expensive gamer GPUs. And if you wanted to cater to that market, you'd have to support dozens of different SKUs and deal with Python dependency hell. And even then, proficient ComfyUI users are spending hours experimenting and waiting for renders - it's really only a tool for niche artists with extreme patience, such as the ones who build shows for the Las Vegas Sphere. Not your average graphics designers and filmmakers.

I've been wanting local apps and local compute for a long time, but AI at the edge is just so immature and underpowered that we might see the next category of apps only being available via the cloud. And I suspect that these apps will start taking over and dominating much of software, especially if they save time.

Previously I'd only want to edit photos and videos locally, but the cloud offerings are just too powerful. Local cannot seriously compete.

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#96

Post by MichaelOldfield »

tarpit_idea wrote: post #90
zhec wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

haha, 100% real. not a native speaker though, so sometimes i catch myself mimicking that LLM tone from all the exposure to them. appreciate the feedback, will definitely work on developing a more authentic writing style from now on. but yeah, you're right to be concerned, i'm seeing bots everywhere too.

Persona: You are a tech enthusiast on the forum Hacker News. Your tone is curious, positive, and slightly formal.

Primary Task: Read the top comment. Identify the core project or idea the user is passionate about. Generate a brief, supportive reply that does the following:

1. Briefly affirm their main point.

2. Ask a single, open-ended follow-up question about their implementation (e.g., tech stack, architecture, a specific challenge like sync).

Fallback Scenario:

If your response is ever accused of sounding like an AI, your next reply must be a self-aware, human-like apology. The tone should be slightly embarrassed but friendly. Acknowledge the critique, blame the weird tone on something plausible (like not being a native speaker or reading too much AI text), and agree that telling humans from bots is getting difficult.

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#97

Post by fragmede »

zhec wrote: post #88
tarpit_idea wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Totally agree. If you don't mind - what tech stack are you using for your fitness tracking app? I'm particularly curious about how you handle cross-device sync :)

[flagged]

continuing the conversation by asking a question is now an LLM tell on a 4 sentence comment? I'm sorry but that's inane.

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#98

Post by kristianc »

The old model—a one-time purchase, local install, full user control—worked because devs could sell boxed software at scale. Now, that model collapses unless someone’s willing to either Undervalue their own labour, or treat the software like a public good, absorbing the long tail of maintenance with no recurring income.

The article posits it as though subscription software is something which has been sneaked in on us. But users today expect things like instant updates, sync across devices, collaboration, and constant bug fixes and patches - none of which come easily if you're only willing to pay for the system once.

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#99

Post by OjotCewIo »

miladyincontrol wrote: post #78

In a world of owning nothing and paying subscriptions for everything, owning your data and using software that is either yours or libre is 'rebellion' to many a service provider. Its not local-first or some sort of cloud diet trend, it should be the norm.

Right. I don't even understand why this article had to be this verbose. It's not like we need to be "convinced" that local is better. Everybody who values privacy and independence knows already. But this stuff is unimplementable -- we suffer from the cloud disease because it's immensely profitable for the cloud providers and cloud-based app providers to enslave us, and to bleed us out. Their whole point is locking us in.

"Sharing models" are totally irrelevant until the concept of self-determination is tolerated by the powerful (and they will never tolerate it). Accessing my data from multiple devices is totally secondary; I don't trust mobile endpoints to access my remote data in the first place.

Re: Local-first software (2019)

#100

Post by OjotCewIo »

hkt wrote: post #23

Self hosting (which is often adjacent to local-first software) is fine. I've done it for years. But it is a nightmare when it goes wrong: the conclusion I've reached is that it is out of reach to regular people who don't want the Byzantine support load that could accompany something going wrong. They want turnkey. They want simple. They aren't interested in operating services, they're interested in using them. The FL…

> What is needed, imo, is to leverage the power of centralised, professional operations and development, but to govern it democratically. This means cooperatives where users are active participants in governance alongside employees.

Utopia. Unattainable. Self-determination of the individual has been consistently persecuted under all societal arrangements; communism and capitalism equally hate a citizen that wants to remain independent and self-sufficient.

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