All the scientists who came to the US in 1930s were mostly Jewish for obvious reasons. After victory in WW2, we had Operation Paperclip when we brought thousands of Nazi affiliated scientists to work for us, the whole premise that scientists fled Nazi Germany is very shaky. I just don't believe so many people don't know the history...
American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
91–100 of 129 posts
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#92Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah I just mentioned Norway since I'm Norwegian. Other EU countries are doing similar, like France[1]. [1]: https://www.politico.eu/article/meet-first-academic-refugees...
100M NOK is a 1% increase to Norway's annual research budget, but to replace what the current US administration is asking Congress to cut the whole of Europe would have to raise its funding level by 300-400%.
It's worth considering that there's still a chance that the cuts end up being more limited than proposed.
Kind of like the tariffs or the Tiktok ban that's totally going to go into effect after the most recent extended grace period ends.
So it makes sense that the current raises aren't big enough to make up the shortfall. They're aniticipatory in nature, with the assumption that the actual cuts will be a lot less crazy, and increases to take advantage of a talent exodus will take some time to ramp up.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#93Earlier quoted context omitted.
To be fair, there are still many well funded private research labs, they just focus on "sexy" easy-to-market science like quantum computing, photonics, deep learning, robotics etc.
That's engineering . Science involves laws and facts about the natural world that are not yet known.
There's a lot of overlap between science and engineering, a lot of the things being affected by the cuts would be engineering by your definition.
E.g. designing scientific instruments. The fundamental physics and chemistry can be well understood, and yet you need a strong overlap of scientists and engineers to produce and run something that actually collects useful data, especially at the cutting edge, where new things actively need to be discovered and built to achieve the desired capability. Another growing one is using AI to drive scientific discovery (e.g. sifting through the terabytes of data being generated everyday and identifying things of potential interest), it isn't strictly an engineering problem, as the entire point is that you don't fully know what you are/are not looking for.
There's a reason most of the things I mentioned also hire plenty of physicists.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#94Earlier quoted context omitted.
The parallel isn’t perfect. But the deep irrationality driving artificial opportunistic ideological divides (this time less raw white supremacy, but still a lot of xenophobia, party loyalty propaganda, cult of personality, and fear and backlash with respect to minorities), drives sub-cultures like lemmings, off the cliff of reality. Taking the rest of us with them. Obvious even as it becomes unstoppable.
Yeah and the infrastructure of economic/political exclusion is initially just used against that "horrible" group X, but eventually expands to the majority of the population. This is because greed is basically an endless hole. They get to threaten the wider population "toe the line or you'll end up like them". A lot of times the effects are invisible. I doubt everyday Mississippians even think about how slavers stole…
Yes, horrible starts as a scapegoated minority that can’t defend itself, who are treated performatively badly to shake out whowever won’t go along with the excess. These become the next trailers. This keeps expanding to include anyone who has any opinion different from the leader(s).
The continually incrementally enslaved majority is told that each thing they give up is just a temporary sacrifice until they have lost all their freedoms. Even then, their hardships are blamed on scapegoats, to maintain their “leader’s” grip on their minds and loyalty.
Anyone raising alarms is a traiter.
Watching the Republican Party metamorphose into group think, hero worship, the last couple decades has been deeply troubling.
Seeing the inability of any effective opposition or remedy, has been equally troubling.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#95Earlier quoted context omitted.
Then I have trouble believing you understand how cutting-edge research happens, because these organizations are the ones who fund it. The missing piece here is DOE Office of Science, but they're coming for that too.
you ever worked with DOE office of science or anyone at the national renewable energy labs? not the brightest lightbulbs out there.
> not the brightest lightbulbs out there
That’s true—all the brightest bulbs are working at FAANG companies building advertising delivery services, or at Fintech companies figuring out how to gamble faster.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#96> Many of the most valuable scientific organizations in the world, including NOAA, NASA, the NSF, the CDC, the EPA, and the FDA, I don’t dismiss the premise of the article and I think it is a shame how these organizations are being impacted, but I don’t know that these are the best exemplars of cutting edge science being shut down that will lead to America’s downfall from its scientific perch.
Why do you believe those aren't good examples of cutting edge science funding? I get the stereotype that government organizations of all types are just stodgy bureaucrats stuck a few decades in the past, but the reality at least in the US in the year 2025 is that truly cutting edge science is not obviously being funded at any significant scale anywhere but government. The world of privately funded research organizati…
> Why do you believe those aren't good examples of cutting edge science funding?
They are, but the article asserts, without evidence, that the US, like Nazi Germany, has passed a threshold where it is going to lose its preeminence in scientific research.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#97[dead]
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#98I don't clearly see how a massive exodus of American scientists moving abroad could happen. While I understand that young scientists might find it easier to relocate, the decision becomes significantly far more complicated for couples, even when both partners are scientists. For other countries or regions to become truly competitive, they would also need to increase their investment in science significantly [1]. [1]…
If all the jobs doing research disappear because all the funding is cut, then what other choice to they have?
If one parent loses their job and cannot get a new one in their field, they have to either switch career (and start a new career at a lower point) or they take a longer-term view, assume that the other parent will also lose their job, and switch country.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#99All the scientists who came to the US in 1930s were mostly Jewish for obvious reasons. After victory in WW2, we had Operation Paperclip when we brought thousands of Nazi affiliated scientists to work for us, the whole premise that scientists fled Nazi Germany is very shaky. I just don't believe so many people don't know the history...
The US had Jewish scientists and Nazi affiliated scientists come over, and proceeded to become the singular global superpower.
That’s a massive accomplishment, and kinda proves that a whole bunch of people there were victims of circumstance, a do or die situation.
Never underestimate the ability of a small percentage of malevolent people to upend society.
Re: American science to soon face its largest brain drain in history
#100All the scientists who came to the US in 1930s were mostly Jewish for obvious reasons. After victory in WW2, we had Operation Paperclip when we brought thousands of Nazi affiliated scientists to work for us, the whole premise that scientists fled Nazi Germany is very shaky. I just don't believe so many people don't know the history...
The US had Jewish scientists and Nazi affiliated scientists come over, and proceeded to become the singular global superpower. That’s a massive accomplishment, and kinda proves that a whole bunch of people there were victims of circumstance, a do or die situation. Never underestimate the ability of a small percentage of malevolent people to upend society.
Yes, just pointing out that this article implies that Nazi Germany was the reason many scientists moved to the US which isn't the case, many moved when the war was over and they lost.