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Snow - Classic Macintosh emulator

snowemu.com

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Re: Snow - Classic Macintosh emulator

#91

Post by jamwil »

coldpie wrote: post #89
jamwil wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you harbour an honest expectation that computer UIs will look the same in 2035 as they do in 2025? That would prove to be a silly thing to hope for if you were to backtest it. It’s not churn its change, and it’s inevitable. No sense getting worked up over it.

Sure, why not? My desktop environment hasn't significantly changed since I first set it up in 2007. The screenshots here[1] span more than 20 years (XFCE 4.0 was released in 2003) and, aside from different user-selected theming choices, look substantially similar across that whole time. [1] https://xfce.org/about/screenshots

I like XFCE but you can’t cherry pick a niche DE that is designed for minimalism and extrapolate that to computer UIs writ large, which was the subject of my comment. Gnome, KDE, Windows, macOS… all evolve regularly.

Re: Snow - Classic Macintosh emulator

#93

Post by brirec »

kalleboo wrote: post #38
mrpippy wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Griffin iMate was the most popular ADB-USB adapter from the time, and probably supports non-input devices (it would’ve been the only option at the time to make those dongles work).

Ah yeah, the ones that were sold at the time would work if you passed through USB to an emulator that supported USB hardware, or reverse-engineered their proprietary protocol. I was only thinking of the modern options when I wrote my comment.

You can get used Griffin iMates on eBay from time to time, but you'll want to solder in a new coin cell battery.

Re: Snow - Classic Macintosh emulator

#95

Post by hadlock »

jamwil wrote: post #83
SkyeCA wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are they really changing the UI up again? I am actually so done at this point. The endless UI churn drives me absolutely mad, but I suppose when there's nothing left to do, making it look different is easy. I suppose a built in volume mixer is still too much to ask for though.

Do you harbour an honest expectation that computer UIs will look the same in 2035 as they do in 2025? That would prove to be a silly thing to hope for if you were to backtest it. It’s not churn its change, and it’s inevitable. No sense getting worked up over it.

Linux desktop hasn't changed appreciably since the advent of Windows 2000, perhaps even NT4. That's 1996 or 29 years ago. XP changed the color of the start button and rounded the edges, and Windows 8 had a purple theme but it's been a remarkably consistent design. I think the only reason Microsoft has made any changes to the start bar is so that the marketing department had something visually different to show consumers, since it's such a central part of the GUI. KDE and XFCE are so similar I often forget which one to install on a new computer.

The only improvement I've seen has been for mac they have the command+space launcher which is functionally like the win+type the app you want. Graphical file browsers haven't changed since the original Mac and/or Win 3.1. Mac has never had a good tree view IMO but they do have a version of it.

The only reason UIs would change at this point is to keep UI/UX folks employed and busy, and give the marketing department something new to talk about.

Re: Snow - Classic Macintosh emulator

#96

Post by jamwil »

hadlock wrote: post #95
jamwil wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you harbour an honest expectation that computer UIs will look the same in 2035 as they do in 2025? That would prove to be a silly thing to hope for if you were to backtest it. It’s not churn its change, and it’s inevitable. No sense getting worked up over it.

Linux desktop hasn't changed appreciably since the advent of Windows 2000, perhaps even NT4. That's 1996 or 29 years ago. XP changed the color of the start button and rounded the edges, and Windows 8 had a purple theme but it's been a remarkably consistent design. I think the only reason Microsoft has made any changes to the start bar is so that the marketing department had something visually different to show consum…

If your definition of “appreciably” allows for such variation then I would say this current refresh also hasn’t changed appreciably.

Re: Snow - Classic Macintosh emulator

#97

Post by troad »

InvisibleUp wrote: post #82
troad wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I stopped reading when we got to sarcastic hate-compiling. That whole part could be a thoughtful and compassionate discussion of the state of Mac emulators, and would be much more persuasive if it were, and instead it reads like a blog-length dunk tweet. > I feel like that’s a bit harsh, but I’ll admit that it is needlessly inflammatory. You're asking for a courtesy here that you failed to extend to others. When you…

To clarify, at the time I was aiming for the tone of Tantacrul's popular and well-received videos about poor software UX. (In particular, the MuseScore video is a good comparison; that was also an open source passion project.) Light-hearted ribbing / frustration venting mixed with genuine compassion toward the project's creator and his remarkable effort. Clearly I wildly missed the mark there. I'll try my best to avo…

Look, yes, you did wildly miss the mark. But I respect you owning that.

I think the MuseScore video is reasonably good reference for doing that sort of critique right. I'd gently point out two things. One, the MS video takes time to first explain what good UX is and why it's good, gently winning the viewer over with positive examples. Then it contrasts MS against best practice, relying on that earlier set-up work to ensure the viewer can follow along and see how MS is not quite hitting that mark. Two, it never denigrates MS; instead, it repeatedly affirms the author's enthusiasm for the product. It comes across as fairly compassionate and constructive criticism. Your piece, irrespective of its intent, didn't come off that way.

If you do want to do more criticism in the future, the MS video is a good point of reference. But I would hasten to add that good criticism is genuinely very hard. It takes work to do it right. It's not enough to simply be compassionate, you also have to demonstrate that compassion by weaving it into the final work of criticism. It must be a constant thread from start to finish, not a box one ticks off at the start or end.

A second option is to avoid criticism as such. Your piece could have easily been reframed as 'Mac emulation is really cool, built by these absolute legends, but none of these tools are quite right for me, so I made this fork that scratches my itches, and you might like it too!'. It gets the exact same points across, but does so much more gently.

That's not to say there isn't, at times, place for criticism strictu sensu. There is. But criticism is most effective when it is most constructive. Less cathartic, maybe, but catharsis at the expense of others is hardly something to aspire to.

I've taken the time to browse some more of your site and I think there's some really cool stuff on there. Don't be discouraged, or fall into the trap of being defensive, you have worthwhile things to say. Just do it with the same thought, patience, and compassion you'd want others to extend to you.

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