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An appeal to Apple from Anukari

anukari.com

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Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#91

Post by scarface_74 »

johnnyjeans wrote: post #42
duped wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree with you, but there simply isn't an alternative for pro audio developers. You go where the users are and the majority of the market (by revenue) are Mac users. Now a lot of people may reply to this that Windows isn't that bad with ASIO (third party driver framework) or modern APIs like WASAPI (which is still lacking), or how pipewire is changing things on Linux so you don't need jack anymore (but god…

> You go where the users are and the majority of the market (by revenue) are Mac users. One of the worst things about Apple is how much time and effort they spend trying to lock you into their platform if you want to support it. There's no excuse for it. Even once they have you on their system, they're doing everything in their power to lock you in to their workflows and development environments. It's actually insane…

Exactly what are they suppose to do if not create their own frameworks to bear leverage their own hardware? Do you want them to use cross platform frameworks that are not optimized for their system?

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#92

Post by scarface_74 »

spacemadness wrote: post #64
johnnyjeans wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You go where the users are and the majority of the market (by revenue) are Mac users. One of the worst things about Apple is how much time and effort they spend trying to lock you into their platform if you want to support it. There's no excuse for it. Even once they have you on their system, they're doing everything in their power to lock you in to their workflows and development environments. It's actually insane…

There is an excuse: shareholders. The more lock in there is, the more the champagne flows.

You can’t imagine how often I pine for x86 based Windows laptops with horrible battery life, loud fans, and enough heat that if I work with my laptop on my lap for an extended period of time there will be no future Scarface’s. But I’m locked into my Mac because of the dirth of Windows software.

Not to mention all of the great Android tablets that I can’t get or the much faster Android devices…

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#94

Post by spookie »

jmull wrote: post #81
thraway3837 wrote: post #30

This is all just too much Stockholm syndrome. Apple’s DX (developer experience) has always been utterly abysmal, and these continued blog posts just goes to show just how bad it is. Proprietary technologies, poor or no documentation, silent deprecations and removals of APIs, slow trickle feed of yearly WWDC releases that enable just a bit more functionality, introducing newer more entrenched ways to do stuff but stil…

> Stockholm syndrome I don't think that's apt. What you find to be "abuse" others might find to be the kind of obstacles/issues that every platform/ecosystem has. It probably helps if you never put Apple on a pedestal in the first place, so there's no special disappointment when they inevitably turn out to be imperfect. E.g., just because Apple publishes a new API/framework, that doesn't mean you need to jump on boar…

Their single biggest priority is to provide a better user experience for your customers compared to competitors.

Units sold in the smartphone world uses the same function video game consoles' market does: you simply offer a bigger and better software offerings, not just hardware.

If you, as a developer, have a worse time contributing to that ecosystem, then it is just a matter of time before the users themselves have a worse time with their device.

I take the comment above as a signal that something is clearly not working towards Apple's goals. Of course, you make your own judgements to support a platform or not, but this indicates that decision is a lot easier than it should be. In detriment of Apple's ecosystem.

All in all I wouldn't discount it.

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#95

Post by jonas21 »

I'm having trouble understanding what the problem is -- as in, what are the actual symptoms that users are seeing? How much latency can the app tolerate and how much are you seeing in practice? It would be helpful (to me at least) in thinking about potential solutions if that information were available up front.

Perhaps there's something in this video that might help you? They made a lot of changes to scheduling and resource allocation in the M3 generation:

https://developer.apple.com/videos/play/tech-talks/111375/

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#96

Post by scarface_74 »

eigenspace wrote: post #31
thraway3837 wrote: post #30

This is all just too much Stockholm syndrome. Apple’s DX (developer experience) has always been utterly abysmal, and these continued blog posts just goes to show just how bad it is. Proprietary technologies, poor or no documentation, silent deprecations and removals of APIs, slow trickle feed of yearly WWDC releases that enable just a bit more functionality, introducing newer more entrenched ways to do stuff but stil…

It's honestly nuts that so many developers continue to try to make software on MacOS. I understand the appeal of their current hardware, and I used to even be a big fan of the user experience, but it really seems like attempting to build software in MacOS is like trying to build a house on a sandbar. Apple has done nothing and continues to do nothing to engender any confidence in their platform as a development targe…

Have you programmed using the Windows APIs?

For example there are over a dozen ways to define a string and you constantly are having to convert between them depending on the API you are using.

https://www.reddit.com/r/cpp_questions/comments/10pvfia/look...

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#97

Post by pixl97 »

fxtentacle wrote: post #66
thraway3837 wrote: post #30

This is all just too much Stockholm syndrome. Apple’s DX (developer experience) has always been utterly abysmal, and these continued blog posts just goes to show just how bad it is. Proprietary technologies, poor or no documentation, silent deprecations and removals of APIs, slow trickle feed of yearly WWDC releases that enable just a bit more functionality, introducing newer more entrenched ways to do stuff but stil…

The Apple DX used to be pretty great around 2010. But by now, it's laughably bad. With every additional OS update, they asked for more and more work (and expensive EV signing certificates) to keep our pro audio app working, which is why it has since been abandoned. In fact, I'm now working on a USB hardware replacement for what used to be a macOS app, simply because Apple isn't allowing enough control anymore. Their…

With the potential criminal filings against Apple hopefully we see them back off a bit.

And yea, over the years you could tell Apple stopped giving a shit except to turn everything into an app store where they can earn 30% and it's lessened the experience.

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#98

Post by pixl97 »

jmull wrote: post #81
thraway3837 wrote: post #30

This is all just too much Stockholm syndrome. Apple’s DX (developer experience) has always been utterly abysmal, and these continued blog posts just goes to show just how bad it is. Proprietary technologies, poor or no documentation, silent deprecations and removals of APIs, slow trickle feed of yearly WWDC releases that enable just a bit more functionality, introducing newer more entrenched ways to do stuff but stil…

> Stockholm syndrome I don't think that's apt. What you find to be "abuse" others might find to be the kind of obstacles/issues that every platform/ecosystem has. It probably helps if you never put Apple on a pedestal in the first place, so there's no special disappointment when they inevitably turn out to be imperfect. E.g., just because Apple publishes a new API/framework, that doesn't mean you need to jump on boar…

>What you find to be "abuse" others might find to be the kind of obstacles/issues that every platform/ecosystem has.

Right, that's why judges are making criminal recommendations to the US prosecutors. No abuse at all.....

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#99

Post by bigyabai »

scarface_74 wrote: post #92
spacemadness wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an excuse: shareholders. The more lock in there is, the more the champagne flows.

You can’t imagine how often I pine for x86 based Windows laptops with horrible battery life, loud fans, and enough heat that if I work with my laptop on my lap for an extended period of time there will be no future Scarface’s. But I’m locked into my Mac because of the dirth of Windows software. Not to mention all of the great Android tablets that I can’t get or the much faster Android devices…

This would be a more poignant point if you had to sacrifice any of these things to get better developer experience. But you don't, you're intentionally conflating wildly different things to defend an irrational stance.

Re: An appeal to Apple from Anukari

#100

Post by AndriyKunitsyn »

duped wrote: post #37
thraway3837 wrote: post #30

This is all just too much Stockholm syndrome. Apple’s DX (developer experience) has always been utterly abysmal, and these continued blog posts just goes to show just how bad it is. Proprietary technologies, poor or no documentation, silent deprecations and removals of APIs, slow trickle feed of yearly WWDC releases that enable just a bit more functionality, introducing newer more entrenched ways to do stuff but stil…

I don't disagree with you, but there simply isn't an alternative for pro audio developers. You go where the users are and the majority of the market (by revenue) are Mac users. Now a lot of people may reply to this that Windows isn't that bad with ASIO (third party driver framework) or modern APIs like WASAPI (which is still lacking), or how pipewire is changing things on Linux so you don't need jack anymore (but god…

How is WASAPI lacking? I thought the abundance of FL Studio beat producers proved that for audio work, today, Windows is completely fine.
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