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Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

developer.apple.com

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Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#91

Post by andiareso »

macguillicuddy wrote: post #76
coldcode wrote: post #69

At the risk of not piling on to the Apple dislike here, if you use a non-Apple payment system, and you have an issue, you now need to go to the specific company and payment system, you can no longer demand your money back by dealing with a single company. I presume even more scam apps will take your money and ignore your complaints; imagine trying to sue a company in some foreign country to try to get your money back…

Is this not what the credit card system (with chargebacks and liability shift) is supposed to counter more generally? Lots of these arguments could equally be applied to a shopping mall but we don't require all stores within a mall to use the same merchant services provider.

This is probably the best analogy, however I think what might be different is there is somewhat high of a bar for the merchant/vendor to be operating a legal and legitimate business. On the internet and in the App Store, it’s kind of a Wild West.

Edit: Maybe not globalizing App Store apps would resolve this? Or at least if you want to operate an app in a country, you need to incorporate in that country too? I think that might make it harder for overseas companies to get away with fraud.

Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#92

Post by [deleted] »

arghwhat wrote: post #54
Aaargh20318 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How times have changed. They really haven't. 'Web apps' are terrible, both from an end-user and developer perspective. They are a bloated, overcomplicated mess.

Bloated and overcomplicated are design issues, not technology issues. Plenty of native apps are bloated and overcomplicated. Making good apps is hard.

[deleted]

Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#94

Post by nemomarx »

coldcode wrote: post #69

At the risk of not piling on to the Apple dislike here, if you use a non-Apple payment system, and you have an issue, you now need to go to the specific company and payment system, you can no longer demand your money back by dealing with a single company. I presume even more scam apps will take your money and ignore your complaints; imagine trying to sue a company in some foreign country to try to get your money back…

That's a fair benefit to apple payment, and if the app vendor could offer apple pay (with the extra fee for this benefit) and their own payment system at a different price I think that would be ideal for consumers, yes?

Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#95

Post by fkyoureadthedoc »

HDThoreaun wrote: post #82
fkyoureadthedoc wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends how much cheaper. If my Shonen Jump subscription goes from $2 to $1.70, I'd rather pay the 30 cents than have to click and type for 2 minutes, and then have to solve a mystery to cancel it later. If my ChatGPT Pro (hypothetical, I don't pay for that) went from $200 to $170, maybe worth it.

why not let everyone decide for themselves if they want to pay the extra to do the purchase in app?

Explain to me where I made the argument that they shouldn't?

Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#98

Post by [deleted] »

deeThrow94 wrote: post #38
klabb3 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple was doing malicious compliance all along. It’s not surprising. But this is extremely good news, because it dampens FUD and narratives such as ”the EU is only going after American companies with frivolous rules”. If you get punished this hard for anti-trust, in the US, you are so out of line it’s not even funny. So it adds legitimacy to the free market spirit seen in markets like EU, which has been criticized fo…

> So it adds legitimacy to the free market spirit seen in markets like EU, which has been criticized for making up arbitrary rules for self-interest. I'm confused a) who is taking the concept of free markets seriously, especially in this context where markets (and competition) are arbitrarily defined and owned by corporations and and b) who would view self-interested laws as either surprising or bad? Of course laws a…

[deleted]

Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#99

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 »

coldcode wrote: post #69

At the risk of not piling on to the Apple dislike here, if you use a non-Apple payment system, and you have an issue, you now need to go to the specific company and payment system, you can no longer demand your money back by dealing with a single company. I presume even more scam apps will take your money and ignore your complaints; imagine trying to sue a company in some foreign country to try to get your money back…

Well shit dealing with multiple companies sounds like a drag! We should merge all US companies into one entity!

Re: Apple App Store guidelines remove ban on encouraging external payments in US

#100

Post by laborcontract »

lapcat wrote: post #84
coldcode wrote: post #69

At the risk of not piling on to the Apple dislike here, if you use a non-Apple payment system, and you have an issue, you now need to go to the specific company and payment system, you can no longer demand your money back by dealing with a single company. I presume even more scam apps will take your money and ignore your complaints; imagine trying to sue a company in some foreign country to try to get your money back…

> When Apple controlled the payment system, Apple could be sued in your home country. Have any App Store consumers sued Apple? And were they successful? Apple does refuse App Store refunds all the time. Apple also closes consumer Apple accounts all the time, for some reason or no reason, often refusing to tell the consumer the reason, alleging some kind of fraud, in which case the consumer loses everything they've ev…

fwiw apple has been extremely generous to be on refunds and, while I don't abuse the system, I do get a refund when I think it's deemed necessary, either due to a lack of satisfaction or accidental purchase.

Chargebacks are a huge pain in the butt to deal with and, as someone who's saw this first hand, chargebackery is correlated bad customership (two words that I just made up) to so I can understand that they'd hate consumers doing that instead of going through what's otherwise a pretty fair system.

Dealing with apple support in payments land has been, on the consumer side, one of the less infuriating things that have come out of what is now their support process. That said, the ux for getting refunds and checking on their status is antiquated, perhaps purposefully.

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