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An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

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Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My camera is not an a7r. I paid $1200 for it used. The exposure was 10 seconds, so by your own explanation, the spinning of the earth is not a problem ( as you can clearly see in the photo I linked )

An astronomy photo can commonly require hours or even tens of hours of exposure time.

The noise from a single image of that duration would be unworkable. Even if there were no planes or satellites, nobody would take that as a single exposure.

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#92
post #7
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Startup idea: launch anti-satellite satellites to de-orbit other satellites littering your airspace.

The Kessler syndrome will take care of it

Ok, so just launch junk into space and wait.

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#93
post #16

"Stitching together 343 distinct photos," I don't doubt that this is a real problem for astronomers and photographers, but I feel like if you had to work that hard, it doesn't really make your case.

In his defense, he was shooting a star trail. @10s per exposure, 6 per minute, becomes 360 per hour. I believe 30s might be more appropriate for star trails which makes satellite trails oh so much more obvious. But that means a 2-3 hour session of 2 exposures per minute. I also used to take hundreds of photos in meteor season - and having to diff between meteors and satellites was quite time consuming.

in photos, meteors and satellites do not look the same. satellite trails are consistent lines. meteors start small, flare in the middle, and then ends small again. they are easy for humans to distinguish, so i'd assume some software could do it as well

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a single 10sec exposure in the Aussie outback on old consumer gear ( Sony a7iii ) https://www.instagram.com/p/CersLuLBfCz You don’t need multiples, and you don’t need an overly long exposure.

It sounds like you know what you're talking about until one realizes the earth is spinning. Wide field photos can be shot up to thirty seconds depending on the back and lens. Anything more zoomy than 50mm uncropped you're getting streaks in Best course of action is to take a video and let a stacking program deal with it, especially if you use a real telescope. Also the Sony a7r have like "150,000 ISO " and iirc cost…

Rule of 500. Divide your lens focal length into 500. That's the longest exposure to avoid trails. 500 / 24mm = ~21s so your example would be 500 / 50mm = 10s.

Some random search result:

https://astrobackyard.com/the-500-rule/

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#95
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It isn't that simple, is it? Even if you place the black surface on a spacer (adding mass, might I add), the black surface itself is going to radiate heat back onto the satellite via blackbody radiation. This is always going to create a worse thermal situation unless you can somehow radiate away as much heat as you could with reflections. To see what I mean, check out JWST's thermal shield.

Consider a shaped charge. It seems wild to me that you can direct an explosion with various shapes of the explosive. Perhaps a similar idea can apply to the blackbody radiation - get it to radiate mostly away from the satellite. Also, the black part will be pointed at the Earth, not the Sun.

Not sure what geometry you're thinking of. Whatever idea it is, you're stuck dealing with Kirchoff's law, which says optical emissivity and absorptivity are the same number at any given wavelength. I.e., you can't create "one-way trap doors" for heat flow—that would be a Maxwell's demon. Stacking multiple surfaces isn't a way to circumvent this.

If it's just an asymmetric shape, with different material surfaces pointed in different directions, than that of course is permitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirchhoff%27s_law_of_thermal_r...

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#96
post #10

You know those airplanes with a banner at the beach? I can imagine a constellation of satellites writing ads (live) in space using mirrors and other nifty tech. Unless regulation stops it.

Like regulation stopped trawling the ocean floor?

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An astronomy photo can commonly require hours or even tens of hours of exposure time.

The noise from a single image of that duration would be unworkable. Even if there were no planes or satellites, nobody would take that as a single exposure.

Signal scales with exposure time, noise scales with the root of exposure time. So although the noise increases with time, the signal-noise ratio increases faster. When dealing with astronomy photos, you want to maximise SNR.

(This is a simplification, there are many types of noise including shot noise and thermal noise, but in general this is the rule of thumb you use)

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#99

The clear grid patterns are really fantastic. (I realise that it's bad and all that - but still, those grids are amazing to see)

Had the same thought. In a way, that photo is absolutely stunning and beautiful in its own way. But I do understand how this is a huge problem for the astronomers.

Re: An image of the Australian desert illuminates satellite pollution

#100
post #10

You know those airplanes with a banner at the beach? I can imagine a constellation of satellites writing ads (live) in space using mirrors and other nifty tech. Unless regulation stops it.

Anyone attempting such a thing needs to be instantly put to death.

I’m fine with putting dots in the sky as a necessary side effect of providing some sort of useful service. Worldwide connectivity seems worth making astronomical observations a bit harder. But visual pollution for its own sake should be harshly discouraged.

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