91–100 of 159 posts
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Hmm I just use :w to save in my graphical editors too. It’s easier to type.
No, it's objectively more difficult to type [on a qwerty keyboard]. cmd-s is a single keypress and can be done with a single hand. shift-; w cr is two more and involves a back and forth over the entire keyboard.
I don't understand the obsession with 1980s terminals. They're even less powerful than the contemporary 8-bit home computers. It's perfectly OK to be a retro enthusiast, it's another thing to claim that this is the peak tech to power our modern CLIs, or a solid foundation for portable UIs. From the docs: Stop thinking in standard CSS units like px, em, rem, % Start thinking in Character Cells for spacing, sizing, and…
Occasionally when you see someone using a point of sale terminal that is terminal based, the operator usually flies through the interface like it's nothing. So there's something to be said about those types of interfaces - it may look simple and be text based, but it's the most user friendly for the qualified operator to get things done.
Related: I really liked Blender's text-searchable menus and I wish every GUI app had searchable menus. It's faster than hunting through a static hierarchy. In fact, one of the few criticisms I have of the 4.x era Blender UI is just that it's mildly harder to invoke search.
[0] Which is how linear video edit consoles worked before modern NLEs, mind.
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> Not everyone's work life revolves around GUIs just because yours does. FTFY They both have their place, pros and cons, that fit different purposes differently. The mistake is in trying to assign superlatives. Two things can be true at the same time, TUIs are superior to GUIs, and GUIs are superior to TUIs, but in different contexts.
> Two things can be true at the same time, TUIs are superior to GUIs, and GUIs are superior to TUIs. TUIs are GUIs - in a trench coat. A TUI program must still process input events, draw widgets, manage state & focus, etc - all the things a GUI must do. What OTOH it can't do, is even the most basic stuff, like system clipboard or displaying pictures. You have to use side channels to get that, and once you do, you thr…
I also don’t know why you consider manipulating the system clipboard a side channel. The terminal emulator provides a way of manipulating the clipboard but that is just convenience.
Any program can access the clipboard and a TUI program can do this as well. I have a grepalike that inserts a search match into the clipboard for convience. Somewhat ironically most of the time that match gets pasted back into the terminal.
I would actually like to have a network wide clipboard system. There are solution for that but I haven’t yet found any that isn’t too unwieldy.
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I don't understand exactly what you are trying to say. I think a REPL is the real-eval-print-loop used by lisp systems to talk to a terminal, or something that looks/works like that (but maybe doesn't use lisp). These days I think lots of things have REPLs. Even Python. The only ones to survive 40 years though, have been serial ones, and I don't think that's an accident. That command box/area that the user uses and r…
That is a a barebones REPL from early 1960's, not the experience I was mentioning. Imagine Emacs mixed with Jupiter netbooks, for the whole OS stack.
Sounds dreadful.
> That is a a barebones REPL from early 1960's, not the experience I was mentioning.
No, that is a definite article. I was talking about three things, two of which are things you brought up in an effort to find common ground. If you don't know Oberon or Acme then there's no point in talking to you about them. I still don't know what you're trying to tell me, and I'm beginning to think you don't either.
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Hmm, Not really convinced. I like TUIs and also the aesthetic of them. Much faster to use on a keyboard than point clicking all over the place with a mouse on the screen or typing the long commands and flags and forgetting a single flag and having to typing it once again.
If you forget a flag, can't you move your cursor and add the flag? No need to type the whole command again
On macOS, you can hold Option and click to emulate the correct amount of left or right arrow presses to move the cursor.
So, no, you don't need to type the whole command again. I would personally probably hit Ctrl + a and move my cursor forward a few words to where I need to add the flag.
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Occasionally when you see someone using a point of sale terminal that is terminal based, the operator usually flies through the interface like it's nothing. So there's something to be said about those types of interfaces - it may look simple and be text based, but it's the most user friendly for the qualified operator to get things done.
Good GUI apps have shittons of keyboard shortcuts to achieve the same result. The ideal is that the qualified operator keeps their hands on the keyboard for anything that isn't an actual pointing operation. For example, in a video editing app, you can rough-cut with a handful of keys[0] for setting in and out points, jogging through the source material, and inserting into the current active timeline. The keyboard isn…
They do on mac: shift+⌘+? opens a "search menu" menu.
I don't understand the obsession with 1980s terminals. They're even less powerful than the contemporary 8-bit home computers. It's perfectly OK to be a retro enthusiast, it's another thing to claim that this is the peak tech to power our modern CLIs, or a solid foundation for portable UIs. From the docs: Stop thinking in standard CSS units like px, em, rem, % Start thinking in Character Cells for spacing, sizing, and…
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Occasionally when you see someone using a point of sale terminal that is terminal based, the operator usually flies through the interface like it's nothing. So there's something to be said about those types of interfaces - it may look simple and be text based, but it's the most user friendly for the qualified operator to get things done.
Good GUI apps have shittons of keyboard shortcuts to achieve the same result. The ideal is that the qualified operator keeps their hands on the keyboard for anything that isn't an actual pointing operation. For example, in a video editing app, you can rough-cut with a handful of keys[0] for setting in and out points, jogging through the source material, and inserting into the current active timeline. The keyboard isn…
On macOS and KDE (Wayland), they do! Agreed it's really handy.
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This is getting quite off-topic, but I do love music. At least, that's how I would describe it. I just heard a fragment of something truly beautiful, and the my emotional attachment to that music is quite real (in this case, the Largo of Bach's concerto for two violins, BWV 1043; although I know someone who dismissed it as long-winding). But words tend to get nerfed, and clickbait culture certainly doesn't help. "Sla…
I would love to help bring elegance and beauty to the software we build, both on the inside and outside - and that's my main motivation behind criticising terminals and TUIs specifically. I have vague ideas for how I could build something ergonomic, easy, and pleasant to use, but I lack experience in this area, and the focus/energy to experiment. I'm hoping to bring this subject to the light, and have a constructive…
But inspiration is a fickle thing. If you're going to build something, you might as well be inspired by terminal-style interaction, but it can't be the goal.
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Good GUI apps have shittons of keyboard shortcuts to achieve the same result. The ideal is that the qualified operator keeps their hands on the keyboard for anything that isn't an actual pointing operation. For example, in a video editing app, you can rough-cut with a handful of keys[0] for setting in and out points, jogging through the source material, and inserting into the current active timeline. The keyboard isn…
> every GUI app had searchable menus They do on mac: shift+⌘+? opens a "search menu" menu.