Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 181 posts

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#91

Post by sensanaty »

rkagerer wrote: post #19

Google used AI to summarize the ~200 questions its employees posed ahead of this meeting regarding its DEI and AI policies. The final two paragraphs of the article are telling: The third-most-popular question employees asked was why the AI summaries were so bad. “The AI summaries of questions on Ask are terrible. Can we go back to answering the questions people actually asked?” it read. I thought summarization was a…

They're okay at best for getting the most generic possible vibe from a large piece of text.

Actually relying on it to accurately summarize many points, it's completely useless. We have it enabled in our meetings and it's hilariously bad at summarizing even the simplest and shortest of meetings.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#92

Post by pupppet »

whimsicalism wrote: post #39
sympil wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is DEI discriminatory? Do you know of studies that have statistics to back up the claim?

its preferential hiring or at minimum recruiting/sourcing on the basis of race, its discriminatory by definition

DE..Inclusion. Not sure what definition you’re looking up, but it is not discriminatory by definition.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#93

Post by pupppet »

yagbo7 wrote: post #87
sympil wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DEI is not about preferential hiring. It’s the opposite. It’s about broadening the perspectives so that one group that has enjoyed historical preferential hiring no longer gets preferential treatment.

That’s a circular definition; stating it’s not about preferential hiring but then saying it’s about not giving a certain demographic preferential treatment. “Enjoyed” is not the right word either. It’s better explained by stating the tech industry is dominated by certain demographics because that’s just how it is, and DEI initiatives give preferential treatment to those who are not in those demographics, in an attemp…

Or it’s ensuring a low skilled white worker doesn’t get selected over a higher skilled minority.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#94

Post by Gigachad »

jdlyga wrote: post #52

DEI will be back under a different name because it's a problem that needs to be solved. It's like the huge backlash against affirmative action.

The problem needs to be solved earlier along the chain than hiring. At education and marketing for education ideally. Companies should hire the best, but schools should be starting everyone off on the right track and the rest should work out.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#95

Post by kadoban »

yagbo7 wrote: post #87
sympil wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DEI is not about preferential hiring. It’s the opposite. It’s about broadening the perspectives so that one group that has enjoyed historical preferential hiring no longer gets preferential treatment.

That’s a circular definition; stating it’s not about preferential hiring but then saying it’s about not giving a certain demographic preferential treatment. “Enjoyed” is not the right word either. It’s better explained by stating the tech industry is dominated by certain demographics because that’s just how it is, and DEI initiatives give preferential treatment to those who are not in those demographics, in an attemp…

> It’s better explained by stating the tech industry is dominated by certain demographics because that’s just how it is

Bigots have used that one forever, defining the current state of affairs as natural and any attempt to improve things as .

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#96

Post by int_19h »

tadfisher wrote: post #80
rl3 wrote: post #27

Microsoft interestingly enough appears to be standing their ground on DEI. [0] Yet, they hopped on the layoff train this time around with a particularly nasty twist. [1] Perhaps they were afraid they'd need to be sociopathic in at least one regard, lest they buck the wider ethos lately. Facebook for example, offered generous severance packages but threw DEI in the trash immediately. [2] [0] https://www.nytimes.com/20…

That is nothing new for Microsoft. I don't think they invented stack-ranking, but they were doing it basically from the 90s until Ballmer left. That's where you're required to cut the bottom 20% of your team every year.

When MSFT did stack ranking officially, the buckets were 20% "overachievers", 70% "achievers", and 10% "underachievers", with the latter being targeted for cuts. If I remember correctly, these specific numbers originated at GE.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#97

Post by int_19h »

knallfrosch wrote: post #14

I always wonder how they do it. These spineless corporate suits. One month they're shoving DEI down your throat ("underrepresented, marginalized"), next month they're killing these programs and writing that they have always hired the "best" people for the job. Obviously, some people of the organization are different, but not all. How do they do it? Just treat it like a job and do whatever the bag full of money demand…

The amount of sociopaths in positions of power of a large bureaucracy is proportional to its size and how powerful the position in question is. Seems to be true of just about anything, from governments to corporations.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#98

Post by pfisherman »

Larrikin wrote: post #16
malcolmgreaves wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These quotas you speak of do not and have never existed. James was a below average engineer who wanted the special treatment of his daddy’s generation.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna835836 Seems like his firing was completely justified. But is also a knock against Google for hiring him in the first place.

I dunno. Could be that the hiring practices at the time, or the team that interviewed him vetted algorithmic problem solving skill and did not run a vibe check on social or emotional intelligence. Because blasting out a company wide post / email disparaging and entire class of people (who are like 50 percent of the population), and then getting indignant about the entirely foreseeable backlash is indicative of extremely low EQ.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#99

Post by ceejayoz »

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #81
edmundsauto wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a more nuanced take on whether professional sports are actually a meritocracy. It depends on the level at which you look. Yes, in any given event it’s generally fair to say the rules are equitable. However, look at golf - we can either accept white people have some genetic advantage, or that access is not equal and the best talent never got a chance to develop. This could be extended to other leagues as well.…

> look at golf Tiger Woods is probably the only professional golfer that the average person knows by name.

Fairness requires more than a single anecdote/aberration.

Re: Google defends scrapping AI pledges and DEI goals in all-staff meeting

#100

Post by MisterKent »

bluedevil2k wrote: post #58
CharlieDigital wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> these programs turned into a hub of biased discriminatory behavior Professional sports went through a "DEI" phase. Despite some rough patches, I'd say that it worked out for the better as a whole if you look at it in retrospect. Similarly, individual companies may have fumbled DEI initiatives, but years on, I think it will have had a (small) positive impact.

How does professional sports go through a DEI phase?? Professional sports are one of the few true meritocracies in the world, where the best players, no matter their race, religion or gender, will play.

What an ignorant take.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_color_line

https://operations.nfl.com/inside-football-ops/players-legen...

Post reply on HN