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Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

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Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#91

Less of us should be discounting the value of investing in new, long-term friendships, in the second or third place we live, and stop discounting the impact of arbitrarily moving away for cheaper or more isolated pastures just because we work remotely. There's a threshold past which it's worth considering how much is worth it to remain, but for many it seems like a no-brainer financial consideration, and they don't r…

Yes but investing in new, long-term friendships is a bit of an oxymoron. In order to do that, you have to pick one set of friends and then stick with them (cuz opportunity cost — the day is only so long). And once you've done so, you then have to stop investing in new friends and stick with those old ones. Cities aren't very conducive to this in part because... people in cities tend to be more transient and their rel…

> Yes but investing in new, long-term friendships is a bit of an oxymoron. In order to do that, you have to pick one set of friends and then stick with them (cuz opportunity cost — the day is only so long). And once you've done so, you then have to stop investing in new friends and stick with those old ones.

I think this is a bit of a false dichotomy that assumes you get a static group of people dumped in your lap—in either case—that you get to choose or be alone because everyone else is guaranteed to choose not you for some reason, and also that long-term friends always require the same amount of investment. Likewise, you seem to be leaning heavily into not having to make a persuasive case for yourself, as if there's never a situation in which you'd be compelling.

Although scarcity might favor ease of intimacy, I think it's more true that luck, opportunity, and chemistry, give any pair of people something to work with regardless of shared interest. You can't assume every person you meet is friend material, but if you and them are open to it, you can both explore further. If 1/5 people seem fun to have coffee or go to the gym with, including in a rural area that may not even have a gym, it'll take a while to build that up, but you'll want a breadth of possible situations to meet people in. Hometowns don't necessitate that, you get it for free in school or church or wherever, but starting anew you gotta get out there.

You're not wrong though, I just think it takes longer. When I moved to where I did, a good half of the people I met were always looking for a plan B, flaking on trivial plans, not interested in one-on-one stuff without an activity going on. That was 8 years ago, and they're long gone. In their place are multiple groups of friends I've met in wildly different contexts, that don't flake enough for me to notice, and I consider pretty solid and close. I let the others go, and likewise with everyone in my hometown that I still talk to, I either can feel great about making a deliberate effort to spend unconstrained time with, or they're not in the picture, and maybe only 4 are left because everyone else is either a shallow acquaintance or were just there out of convenience in the first place.

As you grow older, there is certainly an economy of time you need to manage, but as you grow closer, you get grandfathered into not coming to that one thing or whatever every single time. My friend group consequently grows slower than ever, but is bigger than ever, and I make a point of being the friend I'd like to have—as cheesy as it is; I expect the same of them, and if they can do that then there's something to work with.

Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#93
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tokyo seems to have done this. It’s not cheap by any means, but rent seems relatively affordable relative to pay (and very cheap compared to expensive cities in North America). I wonder if part of the reason is that housing is not an investment vehicle in Japan (probably due to the Japanese preference for newer, more modern builds and the fact that housing is a depreciating asset in an earthquake prone region). In mo…

This is in the category of "things I believe I read from a reputable source, but which I can no longer definitively attribute", but my understanding is that one contributor to Tokyo's lovely and specific density is that its zoning laws are pretty relaxed, and on top of that they are not very strictly enforced. This is maybe less workable in a society with higher variability in people's judgment of what is ok.

And the sheer amount of people. It is very fun to have so many people who are at least semi-proud of the city they live in. Embracing both the chaos and the calmness of 6am on weekeneds.

Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#95
Absolutely you should live somewhere where you have friends nearby. Or better yet live somewhere you can make friends who are nearby. Big cities are the best when you're young and single because there's just so many more opportunities to meet new people that you can make friends with or date. I think the article talks about being with your childhood friends, and maybe that's good for some people but people who make good friends when their 10 won't necessarily be a good fit for each other when they're 25 and that's ok.

Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#96
post #34
post #4

Yes of course. Intentional communities of like minded people are the alternative to atomarisation of strangers living next to strangers with fake smiles and talking behind the back as the standard social interaction. Easier said then done, though in most cases, but worth it wherever possible.

Have you spent time around intentional communities? It's possible you're taking a looser meaning of the phrase than I am, but Intentional Communities have no shortage of toxicity and drama, especially since by their nature these communities filter for people for whom the 'default world' didn't work. That's not to say the concept is bad, but it's very very easy for even a good group to rapidly devolve, the clearer hea…

Rather than an “intentional community” which sounds kind of overbearing to me, I’d be happy to have some way to filter for houses/apartments that are simply in proximity to others who are at least open to making friends and want to be pleasant, neighborly, etc.

I don’t need or particularly want there to be any obligations or explicit organization facilitating this. When people are friendly and open, it happens naturally. You see someone walking the dog and strike up a conversation.

I guess if there was some way to anonymously self-identify as sharing this preference and it got enough traction, you could flag neighborhoods and even specific blocks with more of these people, and then the concentration would perhaps increase over time as people who value these things would pay a bit more to live in these areas.

Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#98
post #46

I go back and forth on this. I still keep in touch with a bunch of high school and college friends. For better or worse those guys know "the real me" and the history and relationships are impossible to replace. They all still live close together but I live far away - I only see them once or twice a year, if that (less right now because we're all in the "very young kids" stage). I miss them. On the other hand, when I…

Move back, force your wife to only interact with your dudes’ wives. Shed individuality, kick back beers with the boyz. Reminisce only about the good old days. Bond over ritualized sports. Start families in sync so kids can be raised together. Forge new shared traditions, establish a rules based order of discipline and brotherhood. Protect the offspring from outsiders. To do this establish dominance over other familie…

Hey @scyzoryk_xyz I laughed out loud and could understand the tongue in cheek sediment before the edits. When I was younger dreamed about becoming rich and buying a whole subdivision and moving my family and friends into the compound. Obviously, that was before I actually had a wife and children. Compromise is the only way relationships work with family and friends.

Good thing is you have more than enough HN Karma to burn so don't worry about the down votes, most people will get ‘it’ and gave you an upvote to offset the ones who did not.

Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#99
post #82
post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was 12 years old, we had to leave a rental house because the landlord sold it. It was very disruptive for us since my parents were low-income and didn’t have much savings. It also took place at a time when market rents increased quite a bit. My parents struggled to find housing; we moved into an apartment temporarily, and two months later we finally found another house to rent that we could afford, but it was…

that's only true in the US though. most other countries have better renter protection. my point was that it's not just renting that forces you to move. you moved yourself because of a job. if you had owned a house you would have had to sell it at that point.

Well for one, I am in the US. Secondly if you owned a house you can rent it out - you don’t have to sell it. It’s a better deal especially in the Bay Area since property taxes are capped.

Thirdly, I move to find better deals on rent - many places I’ve lived don’t have rent control so moving is really the only option to keep costs as low as possible. I moved states because of a job, but within the Bay Area it’s the only way to keep up a desirable savings rate.

Also, try commuting from SF to SJ every day. It’s an incredible waste of time, particularly if you don’t live near the Caltrain (and now BART) corridor.

Re: Should more of us be moving to live near friends?

#100
post #46

I go back and forth on this. I still keep in touch with a bunch of high school and college friends. For better or worse those guys know "the real me" and the history and relationships are impossible to replace. They all still live close together but I live far away - I only see them once or twice a year, if that (less right now because we're all in the "very young kids" stage). I miss them. On the other hand, when I…

New friends?
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