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Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

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Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#91

Post by fsckboy »

dasil003 wrote: post #41
gruez wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's not pedantry when it's the root of the problem. How is this any different than "guns don't kill people, people kill people?"

Because whether it's people pulling the trigger or the gun itself, both are the direct source of harm. Bicycles are not the source of harm, cars are. The analogous argument one way would be quibbling over whether it's the driver or the car. The analogous argument the other would be saying it's the shooting victims fault for being in a place where they are likely to get shot (bad neighborhood, in a position to surpris…

>Bicycles are not the source of harm, cars are.

Of the 1,360 bicyclist deaths in 2022, 928 died in motor-vehicle crashes and 432 in other incidents, according to National Center for Health Statistics mortality data. Males accounted for 87% of all bicycle deaths

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#92

Post by ThunderSizzle »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #61
AnotherGoodName wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Self driving cars are amazing in SF. I cycle there I feel much safer when there’s a self driving car behind me. Waymos, zooxes and cruises never accelerate hard to suddenly cut a turn in front of me rather than waiting behind me to turn across the cycle lane. They never get angry when there is no cycle lane and I’m forced to take up a full lane for a stretch. They have cold machine patience and attitude and to get aw…

> yet I can see a future where humans are barred from driving Increase the unsupervised driving age to 18 (unless in an area with no robotic transport) and massively increase penalties for driving infractions. As in you lose your license on your second DUI or third at-fault collision, reckless-driving ticket or cell phone violation. (Maybe make a DUI count as two infractions for the second list.)

People drive with a suspended license all the time. How else are getting to your job? Getting groceries?

We pretend like driving is only a privilege, but it's more necessary than most rights that OSHA or other agencies have "discovered".

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#93

Post by rahimnathwani »

lubujackson wrote: post #79
jordanb wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A waymo hit a cyclist in San Francisco a few months ago, by failing to anticipate that there may be traffic behind a turning truck and accelerating into it. https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/7/24065063/waymo-driverless-...

Just noting that the bicyclist is fully at fault for trying to jump the queue at a 4 way stop, and it sounds like they were going in a different direction than the turning truck as well. Hard to pin that one on Waymo, though I do feel like Waymo cars tend to drive a bit "city aggressive" at times, like asserting their right of way, sticking close to the car in front, etc.

I don't know what happened in this case, but it's possible that the bicycle stopped at the stop sign before the Waymo did, and then proceeded (behind the truck), entering the intersection before the Waymo. If so, there's nothing wrong with the cyclist's actions.

What I mean is: if the bicycle got to the intersection before the Waymo, then it would have had right of way.

Of course, it's also possible that the cyclist failed to stop at the stop sign.

But neither of us has seen footage of what happened. Presumably Waymo has a recording but, if the cyclist was hidden by the truck, that won't show what happened.

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#94

Post by jorgesborges »

acomjean wrote: post #68
mmooss wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could say that jumping out of a plane without a parachute isn't dangerous, it's the ground that's dangerous. Cyclists make mistakes, make bad judgments, take big risks, just like car drivers. They are human too. You could say cyclists have a bigger incentive to avoid problems, but no driver I know wants to hit someone and injure them, and cyclists I know become inured to the risks after riding for years without i…

I've been urban biking for years. It's no doubt dangerous. I don't think you become complacent like you do when when driving. You are pretty aware that these heavy fast moving vehicles are on the same road as you. Part of my commute was on a path off the roads, it was nice. I always leave plenty of time when riding so im not rushing. even when there are separate lanes it's important to stay alert for cars turning ont…

No complacency is very real and necessary. When I bike everything is my responsibility, my life is in my hands, so I’m not looking to finger-point when a driver does something stupid or rash — it’s on me to be notice, anticipate, and react so that I don’t get killed.

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#96

Post by shkkmo »

mmooss wrote: post #47
nritchie wrote: post #13

As a bicyclist, I'm constantly told how dangerous bicycles are. Usually, I get a blank look when I explain, bicycles are very safe, it is the cars that are the dangerous part of the equation. Now I'll have to add fast billing ambulances to the list of dangers.

You could say that jumping out of a plane without a parachute isn't dangerous, it's the ground that's dangerous. Cyclists make mistakes, make bad judgments, take big risks, just like car drivers. They are human too. You could say cyclists have a bigger incentive to avoid problems, but no driver I know wants to hit someone and injure them, and cyclists I know become inured to the risks after riding for years without i…

I know plenty of drivers who rather risk hitting someone that take a couple of extra seconds to drive safely. It seems to be give or take half of them, depending on the area.

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#97

Post by grogenaut »

jimt1234 wrote: post #46
rconti wrote: post #25

It sounds like what's actually happening here is that the cyclist's auto insurance is picking up the tab, and in turn suing the ambulance company to get their money back. I always find this intersection of the auto and cycling worlds so strange. If he didn't have a car, he wouldn't have auto insurance, so I guess his health insurance would be covering the initial tab, and then suing the ambulance company to get their…

> If you get a moving violation on your bicycle and show a driver's license to the police, it seems you get points in your license ... Can confirm. A friend got a DUI while riding his bicycle. He was guilty as hell, just didn't realize it would affect his driving record.

BUI is a different infraction in many states than DUI, and in some states (WA) it's not even illegal, just like riding a horse while drunk isn't illegal.

Searching the record https://www.bicycleaccidentsnyc.com/new-york-law-on-biking-w... NY (sibling was asking about NY) does not give DUIs for bikes either. The key is Motorized. So you would get on on an e-bike or e-scooter but not a manual scooter, manual bike.

WA you can't even get a public intoxication ticket, you only get tickets if you're disorderly or causing a threat. In WA they CAN take you off the street and impound your bike at no cost to you (you can pick it up free the next day). They're actually supposed to offer you a lift as well.

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#98

Post by johnnyanmac »

Gigachad wrote: post #30
kube-system wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The blank look is probably because cars are ubiquitous, so the distinction is irrelevant to the risk profile the speaker is referring to.

The point is that cycling doesn’t have to be dangerous, it currently is due to external factors that can be fixed.

Even with cars we have a saying: "graves are filled with people who had the right of way". Physics doesn't care about whose to blame.

Re: Ambulance hits cyclist, rushes him to hospital, then sticks him with $1,800 bill

#99

Post by danielmarkbruce »

frankgrimesjr wrote: post #45
danielmarkbruce wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"it was his fault" - not sure you want that on your tombstone.

Would you want "Enjoyed blaming the victims" in yours?

The point is blame doesn't help when you are dead. Keep safe, don't throw yourself in the path of cars with drivers who text.

Former cyclist, now zwifting instead.

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