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Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

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Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#91
General LLM question: a lot of people ask specific knowledge based questions to LLMs. Isn't one of the defining features of modern NPL (and therefore LLMs) that it is designed to be non-deterministic? Meaning that it will intentionally select "less optimal" next tokens at some random rate in order to make it sound less like a robot answering the same thing over and over. If this is the case, isn't it pretty much guaranteed to get knowledge based questions wrong a decent amount of the time?

I could be way off base (I have zero knowledge about the internals and simply read occasional blog posts), but I thought I remembered that being one of the key features to making LLMs sound more human.

Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#93
post #58
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I agree, for these small models it's wasted potential to be closed source, they can only be used effectively if they are open. EDIT: HN is rate-limiting me so I will reply here: In my opinion 1B and 3B truly shine on edge devices, if not than it's not worth the effort, you can have much better models for already dirt cheap using an API.

While I'm all for open models; why can't the small models not be used effectively? Wouldn't they lower the costs compared to big models drastically?

Big models take up more VRAM just to have the weights sitting around hot in memory, yes. But running two concurrent inferences on the same hot model, doesn't require that you have two full copies of the model in memory. You only need two full copies of the model's "state" (the vector that serves as the output of layer N and the input of layer N+1, and the pool of active low-cardinality matrix-temporaries used to batchwise-compute that vector.)

It's just like spawning two copies of the same program, doesn't require that you have two copies of the program's text and data sections sitting in your physical RAM (as those get mmap'ed to the same shared physical RAM); it only requires that each process have its own copy of the program's writable globals (bss section), and have its own stack and heap.

Which means there are economies of scale here. It is increasingly less expensive (in OpEx-per-inference-call terms) to run larger models, as your call concurrency goes up. Which doesn't matter to individuals just doing one thing at a time; but it does matter to Inference-as-a-Service providers, as they can arbitrarily "pack" many concurrent inference requests from many users, onto the nodes of their GPU cluster, to optimize OpEx-per-inference-call.

This is the whole reason Inference-aaS providers have high valuations: these economies of scale make Inference-aaS a good business model. The same query, run in some inference cloud rather than on your device, will always achieve a higher-quality result for the same marginal cost [in watts per FLOP, and in wall-clock time]; and/or a same-quality result for a lower marginal cost.)

Further, one major difference between CPU processes and model inference on a GPU, is that each inference step of a model is always computing an entirely-new state; and so compute (which you can think of as "number of compute cores reserved" x "amount of time they're reserved") scales in proportion to the state size. And, in fact, with current Transformer-architecture models, compute scales quadratically with state size.

For both of these reasons, you want to design models to minimize 1. absolute state size overhead, and 2. state size growth in proportion to input size.

The desire to minimize absolute state-size overhead, is why you see Inference-as-a-Service providers training such large versions of their models (OpenAI's 405b models, etc.) The hosted Inference-aaS providers aren't just attempting to make their models "smarter"; they're also attempting to trade off "state size" for "model size." (If you're familiar with information theory: they're attempting to make a "smart compressor" that minimizes the message-length of the compressed message [i.e. the state] by increasing the information embedded in the compressor itself [i.e. the model.]) And this seems to work! These bigger models can do more with less state, thereby allowing many more "cheap" inferences to run on single nodes.

The particular newly-released model under discussion in this comments section, also has much slower state-size (and so compute) growth in proportion to its input size. Which means that there's even more of an economy-of-scale in running nodes with the larger versions of this model; and therefore much less of a reason to care about smaller versions of this model.

Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#94
post #33

> How many r's in "strawberry"? Think step by step! What a nice question! Well, let's just count: 1. S 2. T 3. R! So, we have our answer: there are 3 R's in "strawberry". Totally checks out!

This is one of the least interesting questions to ask LLMs. I wish it wasn't so popular.

I also think it's kind of a silly example- smart people can be functionally illiterate, after all. It doesn't tell you that much.

My favorite LLM stumper is asking them to solve the farmer/wolf/chicken/grain river-crossing puzzle but with only a chicken. They usually either insist on pointless extra trips or hallucinate a wolf or grain. Liquid somehow does both and also loses track of what's where.

> The farmer can take the chicken across the river first. Then, he can go back to the original side and bring the boat back. He can then take the chicken back to the original side and leave it there. Next, he can take a bag of grain across the river. He can then go back to the original side and bring the chicken across the river. Finally, he can go back to the original side one last time and bring the chicken across the river.

One generation ended like this:

> the farmer and the chicken are both on the other side of the river, and the chicken is safe from the grain.

Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#96
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All it speaks to is that tokenization is weird and introduces artifacts to LLM performance. Counting letters is a trivial task when you're staring at words on a screen. It's much harder when you're perceiving vectors based on parts of words. The fact that LLMs find certain things easier/harder than humans is completely unsurprising, and there are much more interesting benchmarks to use to compare one LLM to another.

Counting shit, like cells, peaks in signals, people, inventory, fingers, and votes, is hard, tedious and important to business and life, so I don’t know dude, it seems like a great benchmark to me. Countless posts wasted on denying this simple and obvious fact.

It's like using a hammer to turn a screw and calling it useless.

To envision what a next generation model bound by the same constraints should do, it'd be to recognize that it can't count tokens and use code access to write code that solves the strawberry problem without prompting.

Asked to count cells it'd be a model that could write and execute OpenCV tasks. Or to go a step further, be a multimodal model that can synthesize 10000 varations of the target cell, and finetune a model like YOLO on it autonomously.

I find arguments that reduce LLMs to "It can't do the simple thing!!!!" come from people unable to apply lateral thinking to how a task can be solved.

Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#97
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All it speaks to is that tokenization is weird and introduces artifacts to LLM performance. Counting letters is a trivial task when you're staring at words on a screen. It's much harder when you're perceiving vectors based on parts of words. The fact that LLMs find certain things easier/harder than humans is completely unsurprising, and there are much more interesting benchmarks to use to compare one LLM to another.

Counting shit, like cells, peaks in signals, people, inventory, fingers, and votes, is hard, tedious and important to business and life, so I don’t know dude, it seems like a great benchmark to me. Countless posts wasted on denying this simple and obvious fact.

So how many 1 bits are in strawberry?

Thats about the same kind of question, given that LLMs see tokens instead of characters, and we see characters instead of bits.

Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#98
Hot take: stop making models. Make products, instead. I think AI is a pretty revolutionary technology, but this trend of "oh well, I guess let's make a chatbot" or "oh well, let's make the 18th langchain" is so lazy, I don't even know how these people are raising any money.

Re: Liquid Foundation Models: Our First Series of Generative AI Models

#100
post #91

General LLM question: a lot of people ask specific knowledge based questions to LLMs. Isn't one of the defining features of modern NPL (and therefore LLMs) that it is designed to be non-deterministic? Meaning that it will intentionally select "less optimal" next tokens at some random rate in order to make it sound less like a robot answering the same thing over and over. If this is the case, isn't it pretty much guar…

> Isn't one of the defining features of modern NPL (and therefore LLMs) that it is designed to be non-deterministic?

Not of all NPL, but it is absolutely a property of LLMs.

But I doubt this even enters into the total figure if you go search for the causes of LLMs giving wrong answers.

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