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Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

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Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#91

Post by troupo »

KaiserPro wrote: post #54
troupo wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They use "open source" to whitewash their image. Now ask yourself a question: where does Meta's data come from? Perhaps from their users' data? And they opted everyone in by default. And made the opt-out process as cumbersome as possible: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1794863603964891567.html And now complain that the EU is preventing them from "collecting rich cultural context" or something https://x.com/nickcl…

> Perhaps from their users' data? nope, not yet. FAIR, the people that do the bigboi training, for a lot of their stuff cant even see user data, because the place they do the training can't support the access. Its not like openAI where the lawyers don't even know whats going on, because they've not yet been properly taken to court. at Meta, the lawyers are everywhere and if you do naughty shit to user data, you are g…

> the lawyers are everywhere and if you do naughty shit to user data, you are going to be absolutely fucked.

I even provided the links that has screenshots of their opt-out form.

--- start quote ---

Al at Meta is our collection of generative Al features and experiences, like Meta Al and Al Creative Tools, along with the models that power them.

Information you've shared on our Products and services could be things like:

- Posts

- Photos and their captions

- The messages you send to an Al

...

We may still process information about you to develop and improve Al at Meta, even if you object or don't use our Products and services. For example, this could happen if you or your information:

- Appear anywhere in an image shared on our Products or services by someone who uses them

- Are mentioned in posts or captions that someone else shares on our Products and services

--- end quote ---

See the words "Meta AI" and "models powering it"?

Meta couldn't give crap about simpler clear-cut cases like "don't track users across the internet", much less this.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#92

Post by Palmik »

naming_the_user wrote: post #20
hyuuu wrote: post #16

the view of the comments here seems to be quite negative for what meta is doing. Honest question, should they go to the route of openai and closed source + paid access instead? OpenAI or Claude seem to garner more positive views than llama open sourced.

The models are not open source, you're getting the equivalent of a precompiled binary. They are free to use.

That's a bad analogy. The weights are much closer to source code, because you can directly modify them (fine tune, merge or otherwise) using open source software that Meta released (torchtune, but there are tons of other libraries and frameworks).

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#93

Post by bee_rider »

dartos wrote: post #89
bee_rider wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think it is a bad analogy, it is just separating out the issues. If the thing required breaking the law to make, it just shouldn’t have been made. But, in that case, Facebook should not accept liability for how their users use the thing. They should just not share it at all, and delete it.

Crayons aren’t made by mashing people’s artwork through a gpu. Crayons don’t generate content either. If I download something from megaupload (rip) megaupload is the one that gets in trouble. They are storing, compressing, and shipping that information to me. The same thing happens with AI, the information is just encoded in the model weights instead of a video or text encoding or whatever. When you download a model,…

This seems more like an argument that the model just shouldn’t have been created, or that it shouldn’t be used. If a model is just an lossy compressed version of a bunch of infringing content, why would Facebook (or OpenAI, or anybody else hosting a model and providing an API to it) be in the clear?

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#94

Post by WithinReason »

monkeydust wrote: post #7

Curious but is there a path where llm training or inference could be distributed across the BOINC network: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Open_Infrastructure...

Not yet, the bandwidth requirement is too high. But if someone figures this out that's when we will have true open source models. A crowdsourced supercomputer can outcompete any corporation's server farm.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#95

Post by progval »

Palmik wrote: post #92
naming_the_user wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The models are not open source, you're getting the equivalent of a precompiled binary. They are free to use.

That's a bad analogy. The weights are much closer to source code, because you can directly modify them (fine tune, merge or otherwise) using open source software that Meta released (torchtune, but there are tons of other libraries and frameworks).

You can also modify a precompiled binary with the right tools.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#96

Post by Palmik »

progval wrote: post #95
Palmik wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a bad analogy. The weights are much closer to source code, because you can directly modify them (fine tune, merge or otherwise) using open source software that Meta released (torchtune, but there are tons of other libraries and frameworks).

You can also modify a precompiled binary with the right tools.

Except doing continued pre-training or fine tuning of the released model weights is the same process through which the original weights were created in the first place. There's no reverse engineering required. Meta engineers working on various products that need custom versions of the Llama model will use the same processes / tools.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#98

Post by camillomiller »

bee_rider wrote: post #93
dartos wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crayons aren’t made by mashing people’s artwork through a gpu. Crayons don’t generate content either. If I download something from megaupload (rip) megaupload is the one that gets in trouble. They are storing, compressing, and shipping that information to me. The same thing happens with AI, the information is just encoded in the model weights instead of a video or text encoding or whatever. When you download a model,…

This seems more like an argument that the model just shouldn’t have been created, or that it shouldn’t be used. If a model is just an lossy compressed version of a bunch of infringing content, why would Facebook (or OpenAI, or anybody else hosting a model and providing an API to it) be in the clear?

To be fair, maybe yes, these models shouldn’t have been created. Well they have been created so now we need a new novel way to make sure they don’t damage other people’s work. Something like this did not exist before, and therefore needs a new set of rules that the model creators, with all their might and power, are trying to strongly lobby against.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#99

Post by monkeydust »

WithinReason wrote: post #94
monkeydust wrote: post #7

Curious but is there a path where llm training or inference could be distributed across the BOINC network: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Open_Infrastructure...

Not yet, the bandwidth requirement is too high. But if someone figures this out that's when we will have true open source models. A crowdsourced supercomputer can outcompete any corporation's server farm.

Yea seems like an inflection moment when it happens. Curious who's working on this problem.

Re: Meta AI: "The Future of AI Is Open Source and Decentralized"

#100

Post by WithinReason »

monkeydust wrote: post #99
WithinReason wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not yet, the bandwidth requirement is too high. But if someone figures this out that's when we will have true open source models. A crowdsourced supercomputer can outcompete any corporation's server farm.

Yea seems like an inflection moment when it happens. Curious who's working on this problem.

It's not in the interest of the big players for sure!
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