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Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

reuters.com

91–100 of 197 posts

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#91
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The PS5 is definitely not dead, it's their main console. The Pro is a niche machine targeted at wealthy enthusiasts. It will only do a fraction of the regular PS5 sales numbers.

I think GP means dead as in there'll be no more design efforts targeted at it.

Right. It will live on. I love it, plan to buy a Pro.

But for their hardware engineers they’re likely done and moved on.

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#94
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1. An important non-obvious detail for AMD is that they (at least in the past, I assume for this as well) have kept the instruction timings similar from generation to generation of consoles. Different x86 micro-architectures benefit from writing the machine code in slightly different ways. Games are highly optimized to the specific micro-architecture of the console, so keeping that stable helps game developers optim…

> Different x86 micro-architectures benefit from writing the machine code in slightly different ways. Games are highly optimized to the specific micro-architecture of the console, so keeping that stable helps game developers optimize for the console. While that can be true, very few gamedev companies these days optimize to that degree. They almost all use off-the-shelf middleware and game engines that are built to su…

How would you explain cross PS5/PC releases being much more efficient on the PS5?

e.g. Horizon Forbidden West needing a much better GPU on PC to run at the same level of fidelity as the PS5.

If not for special tuning specific to the PS5’s differences.

(I can imagine Windows bloat and other junk requiring an additional 10% to 20%, but not 30% to 50%.)

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#95
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft maintained backwards compatibility across Intel+Nvidia, IBM+ATI, and AMD+AMD so it's possible. Sony hasn't invested as much in compatibility, instead just keeping the same architecture for PS4/5.

True but if you're referring to the fact that you can play Xbox and Xbox 360 games on newer hardware, I believe Microsoft has a team that has to individually patch these games to work for newer hardware. Sony does something similar I believe with their new Classics Catalogue as part of their most premium PS Plus tier.

Yeah I remember the Xbox 360 being hit and miss with backwards compatibility - their FAQs said that most of the time the people working on it had to just look at the raw assembly of games they were trying to get running to figure out what went wrong.

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#96
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a PS6 needs to play PS5 games, or Sony will have a hard time selling them until the PS6 catalog is big; and they'll have a hard time getting 3rd party developers if they're going to have a hard time with console sales. I don't think you're going to play existing PS5 games on an ARM CPU unless it's an "amazing" core. Apple does pretty good at running x86 code on their CPUs, but they added special modes to make…

I mean, the PS4 didn't play PS3 games and that didn't hurt it any. Backwards compatibility is nice but it isn't the only factor.

The first year of PS4 was pretty dry because of the lack of BC; It really helped that the competition was the Xbox One, which was less appealing for a lot of reasons

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#97
post #26

According to the writer everything in tech is AI. It bothers me and makes it difficult to take the article seriously. > Similar to how big tech companies like Google and Amazon rely on outside vendors to help design and manufacture custom AI chips > Having missed the first wave of the AI boom dominated by Nvidia and AMD, Intel reported a disastrous second quarter in August.

[deleted]

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#98
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with choosing Nvidia is that they can't make an x86 processor with an integrated GPU. If you're looking to maintain backward compatibility with the Playstation 5, you're probably going to want to stick with an x86 chip. AMD has the rights to make x86 chips and it has the graphics chips to integrate. Nvidia has graphics chips, but it doesn't have the CPUs. Yes, Nvidia can make ARM CPUs, but they haven't be…

Emulating x86 would be an option - though given Sony's history, I doubt they'd consider it seriously. For context... - PS1 BC on PS2 was mostly hardware but they (AFAIK?) had to write some code to translate PS1 GPU commands to the PS2 GS. That's why you could forcibly enable bilinear filtering on PS1 games. Later on they got rid of the PS1 CPU / "IO processor" and replaced it with a PPC chip ("Deckard") running a MIP…

> No BC was attempted on PS4 at all, AFAIK. PS3 is a weird basketcase of an architecture, but even PS1 or PS2 aren't BC supported.

To Be Faiiiirrrrrr, that whole generation was a basket case. Nintendo with the motion controls. Microsoft with a console that internally was more PC then "traditional" console (and HD-DVD). Sony with the Cell processor and OtherOS™.

I do have fond memories of playing around with Linux on the PS3. Two simultaneous threads! 6 more almost cores!! That's practically a supercomputer!!!

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Different x86 micro-architectures benefit from writing the machine code in slightly different ways. Games are highly optimized to the specific micro-architecture of the console, so keeping that stable helps game developers optimize for the console. While that can be true, very few gamedev companies these days optimize to that degree. They almost all use off-the-shelf middleware and game engines that are built to su…

How would you explain cross PS5/PC releases being much more efficient on the PS5? e.g. Horizon Forbidden West needing a much better GPU on PC to run at the same level of fidelity as the PS5. If not for special tuning specific to the PS5’s differences. (I can imagine Windows bloat and other junk requiring an additional 10% to 20%, but not 30% to 50%.)

The comment above is elaborating on x86 micro-architecture, the differences between how the CPU handles x86 instructions specifically.

The overall system architecture is different between PC, which has discrete memory systems for the CPU and GPU, and a very long pathway between GPU memory and system/CPU memory, versus today's consoles which have unified memory for CPU+GPU, and optimized pathways for loading from persistent storage too.

Consolesuse their own graphics APIs, but you would have any vendor you contract with for graphics support your native graphics API and everything would be "fine". PS5 games use GNM/GNMX Playstation proprietary graphics APIs. Usually PC ports of console native games re-implement the rendering engine using the PC graphics APIs like DirectX or Vulkan. The re-implementation is probably less efficient and less tuned.

Re: Intel lost the Sony Playstation business to AMD

#100
post #37

No one appears to have mentioned the important meta game going on: Intel bidding as a credible alternative supplier. For Intel, by bidding they get to undercut AMD's profits. For Sony, they get a credible alternative which they can pretend would be a viable choice. Thus forcing a slightly better deal from AMD. We saw similar articles related to the Switch 2. That time it was AMD acting as spoiler to Nvidia. Nvidia re…

Yeah, this was rigged from the start. If Sony did want to take up Intel next gen, they'd need to do a lot of work on backwards compatibility with the PS5 on the PS6. Whereas I imagine the PS6 being a "PS5 Pro Pro" at this rate. I suppose it can be seen as controlling rampant greed (especially for Nvidia), but it feels like the consoles dealt the cards here. There would have needed to either be some revolutionary tech…

> At this point Nintendo is skewed towards ditching (SNES/N64/Gamecube/Switch vs. Wii/WiiU).

Ultimately, a company is its people. And the management class at Nintendo is famously new. Everybody is expecting them to focus on robust backwards compatibility as part of their new, exciting development.

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