Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain • Hacker News Board

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#91

Post by titanomachy » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 8:57 PM UTC

kjkjadksj wrote: post #66

empath75 wrote: post #49

I can't think of anything in the world I would enjoy doing less than completing "a simple auditory–visual matching task" while in an MRI scanner on shrooms.

The set and settings researchers typically use for usual psych studies are going to bias psychedelic results so much. Think that building you hated in undergrad's crusty unlit cinderblock basement with no windows but coated in cameras and microphones. Its so dystopian, you are literally a caged rat. I don't think you can perform this research in good faith without having experienced a proper trip yourself. It's just…

gleam -> glean

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#92

Post by progmetaldev » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 8:58 PM UTC

lamp_book wrote: post #87

Unbefleckt wrote: post #52

While it's amusing in the short term, the long term side effects for me were awful. I felt like my brain was slow and unfocused, I was no longer quick in conversation or able to concentrate as well as usual, I felt disconnected from myself, sort of like when you recall a memory so old that it seems like it belongs to someone else, I had a headache for almost 3 weeks. Throwing this in here as there are a fair few "dud…

Sounds like it could be mild dissociation/depersonalization. It's not typically considered a primary effect of psilocybin, but there is a small mention here on classical psychedelics: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissociative

I was already predisposed to anxiety, but after using LSD quite a bit in my teens, my anxiety took over my waking life. During high anxiety and panic attacks, I often experience dissociation/depersonalization effects. I feel like I am disconnected from myself, and watching what is happening, like in a dream. The only thing I really connect with is the anxiety and fear. Over the years, through therapy and medication, this has become rarer.

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#93

Post by free_energy_min » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 8:59 PM UTC

jppittma wrote: post #51

jkingsman wrote: post #6

This concerns Functional Connectivity[0], which is basically a measure of how temporally correlated regions are; those that fire in sync or in a strongly correlated pattern are functionally connected. Essentially, the TL;DR of this study is that psilocybin's 5-HT2A agonism seems to reduce synchronized FC activity not just in neurons but the whole brain: psilocybin makes parts of the brain overall that otherwise work…

I think the fact that nobody knows how to deal with negative correlations in functional connectivity takes away from the validity of the whole concept. People literally throw out negatively correlated voxels/ROI's. This, on top of the fact that functional connectivity is only related to physical connectivity in the abstract. (it's about the correlated time series activity in pixels over time, and isn't bound by any c…

any source that mentions throwing away negative correlations?

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#94

Post by brotchie » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:02 PM UTC

lawlessone wrote: post #31

>Healthy adults were tracked before, during and for 3 weeks after high-dose psilocybin (25 mg) and methylphenidate (40 mg), and brought back for an additional psilocybin dose 6–12 months later. Not simultaneously I hope.. that sounds like it would be a rough ride

"it can generally be assumed that there is approximately 15 mg (+/- 5 mg) of psilocybin per gram of dried mushroom" -Wikipedia

So 25mg is ~1.5g of dried mushrooms.

Decent dose, but not a "omg I'm one with the universe."

For instance, a "Hero Dose" typically starts at 5g of dried mushrooms, so ~3x the dosage used in the study.

Though it's possible the uptake rate using their dosing mechanism is much higher than "stomach acid digested dried mushrooms."

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#95

Post by GuB-42 » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:05 PM UTC

trallnag wrote: post #85

LSD is better, sorry :/

Psilocybin and LSD are both psychedelics and 5-HT2A agonists. Even though the study uses psilocybin, the findings should apply to LSD too.

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#96

Post by mike_ivanov » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:13 PM UTC

It's interesting that brain hypersynchronicity is a known source of epileptic seizures (among other things). This potentially could be a treatment for this specific problem.

See e.g.

  * https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S089662731930964X
  * https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1528-1167.2010.02805.x

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#97

Post by lucidrains » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:14 PM UTC

empath75 wrote: post #49

I can't think of anything in the world I would enjoy doing less than completing "a simple auditory–visual matching task" while in an MRI scanner on shrooms.

Indeed, the best setting is in nature on a beautiful day

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#98

Post by INTPenis » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:42 PM UTC

TechDebtDevin wrote: post #17

PSA: My buddy shot himself in the head while we were on shrooms in our twenties. He thought he meant God, took a shower picked up a gun and shot himself in the head. While I've had trips since then and do get benefits from those experiences. People without experience should be careful, especially if you have a history of mental illness. He did have a history to some degree but not overtly.

Everyone who has tripped hard and come out unscathed can consider themselves lucky to have such a strong constitution. I am a firm believer in that psychdelics are wonderful, but powerful. And not everyone can handle the experience. At one end might be a slightly anxious trip, but at the other end is a complete breakdown of your reality.

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#99

Post by fullspectrumdev » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:45 PM UTC

jajko wrote: post #63

baq wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This percentage is much smaller in other countries, so actually it is... if you don't live in the USA, which is a large majority of the world's population.

Many countries in Europe have tons of older hunting guns, on top of newish guns for... personal protection? Sport? Or whatever reason people feel the need to have them. Tens of millions as per wikipedia [1]. Also check other countries and continents. A very valid argument. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_g...

In most European countries you have to store the firearm in a locked safe, often with the bolt removed or the weapon disassembled and - quite often - with the ammunition stored separately in another locked container/safe.

It’s a lot more “steps to take” to commit suicide than “take the weapon from your nightstand and shoot yourself”, given you have to unlock usually more than one safe/lockbox.

Re: Psilocybin desynchronizes the human brain

#100

Post by DaoVeles » Wed, Jul 17, 2024, 9:48 PM UTC

notnaut wrote: post #12

While the analogies are often useful, everyone reading HN comments should be very aware and very skeptical of just how often computer/tech people rely on computer/tech analogies to understand things that are fundamentally not computers/tech. It is very very easy for smart people with functionally specific jobs/hobbies/ways of thinking to see all reality through that narrow window. It often leads to important details…

My favorite shrooms story is from reddit.

Someone when taking schrooms would always "talk to God" and would get answers but they could never remember them the next day. So one day they ensured they had a notepad around to write down the answers.

They did the trip and asked "What is the meaning of life?". When they woke up all that was written on the note pad was "walls".

It must have felt profound at the time but it was basically meaningless. And that is a lot of drugs.