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Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

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Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#91

Post by Hizonner »

phs318u wrote: post #76
AlbertCory wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They may suck at many things Exactly. I gave examples of actual tech projects undertaken by governments, so an abstract discussion of "government vs. private industry" is not really on point here.

You're attacking a straw man. Where governments do well is establishing a regulatory framework. They don't deliver the clean water. They (should) ensure that the water that's delivered meets a standard.

In every single city I've ever lived in or paid attention to, the water system has been directly operated by employees of the municipal government, not private companies and not even contractors. And the regional projects they buy from tend to be pure government, too.

Oh, and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_privatization#Prevalence

But, hey, never let facts interfere with your deeply held religious beliefs, eh?

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#92

Post by dbuser99 »

stubish wrote: post #62

Now I'm curious as to the reasoning Sam got back in. The board is there for a purpose and has legal duties. Did they have some duty to cave in when the company was threatened, overriding their oversight duties that caused them to sack Sam in the first place? Did they decide they just got it wrong? It seems pretty wobbly, and makes me question if boards are useful at all for many companies in today's world (and what o…

Financial rewards. Money.

Investors could not take the risk of disturbing the value of their investment.

It is that simple

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#93

Post by boringg »

qp11 wrote: post #59
snowwrestler wrote: post #52

Kind of ironic that people are jumping in here to defend Sam Altman on the message board of Y Combinator, which also fired him from an executive leadership role for similar reasons.

[flagged]

He’s not a very defensible person blindly ambitious about power.

Kind of weird to be cheering for Elon to knock off Microsoft/OpenAI effort.

Also funny to think of Google as an also ran offering for AI.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#94

Post by bmitc »

sixQuarks wrote: post #73
EA-3167 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also a similar reason that Sam was fired from Y Combinator. None of this should be new, it's just when there's money on the line people's memories get as fuzzy as their morals.

I didn’t know he was fired from y combinator, what were the details?

Explicit details were never released because for some reason people seem to like watching Altman fall his way up the ladder.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#95

Post by preommr »

Aunche wrote: post #75

I think there is a very good chance this is true, but it also paints the picture of the board being incompetent and incapable of confrontation. They could have filed formal complaints, mandated increased scrutiny, handed off Sam's responsibilities to other people, or threatened legal action. Instead, they attempted a secret coup, which of course makes Sam look like the underdog

What would be the point of having him as CEO if they mistrusted him so much that they would have to put a metaphorical straightjacket on him to make sure he behaved well?

Not to mention that if he was vengeful, it would be much easier to do damage from within and from a position of power.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#96

Post by pdonis »

xyzzy4747 wrote: post #83
pdonis wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In this case all Sam did was step on a few toes and hurt the egos of a few board members. No, he lied to other board members, multiple times.

Sounds like he outsmarted them and they were holding back the organization.

Lying is not "outsmarting", it's lying.

As for "holding back the organization", if we're talking about existential risk, I want them to be held back. These people have no business being stewards of any technology that might be an existential risk.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#97

Post by breck »

> "telling us they had no belief that he could or would change, no point in giving him feedback"

This is awful behavior. Never ever stop talking. Never ever stop giving feedback.

When someone says something along the lines of "the other person wasn't listening so I had to take action against them", they are almost always lying. (They are probably lying to themselves most of all).

The other person usually is listening, it's just that they aren't snapping to right away (often for very valid reasons). I don't know what the word is for this type of behavior ("snakish?"), but I would be wary of those executives.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#98

Post by boringg »

goodluckchuck wrote: post #89

> constantly was claiming to be an independent board member with no financial interest in the company That sounds criminal.

self dealing isnt criminal its just super suspect. Good question though - actively telling the board a bald faced lie, is that criminal? Certainly justifies getting fired.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#99

Post by threeseed »

xyzzy4747 wrote: post #83
pdonis wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In this case all Sam did was step on a few toes and hurt the egos of a few board members. No, he lied to other board members, multiple times.

Sounds like he outsmarted them and they were holding back the organization.

This is the attitude of a rebellious child instead of a professional.

Boards serve a vital fiduciary duty to ensure good corporate governance.

They do not exist to hold back the organisation and are not there to be outsmarted.

Re: Ex-OpenAI board member reveals what led to Sam Altman's brief ousting

#100

Post by nullspace »

bmitc wrote: post #86

What is still bizarre is how the board brought him back. I just don't understand that from any angle. It is very clear that he lied and schemed. So why was there any issue? He had no power once fired. If another company wants to hire him, fine. If he wants to make platitudes on Twitter, who cares? Employees threatened to leave? Let them. I imagine many of them wouldn't, and if they did, you could just rehire and find…

100% agree. I don’t care about OpenAI or the members of its board at all, one bit.

What I did see was so much incompetence at the one thing I expect a board to be at least okay at. Hiring and firing.

For that alone, I think the board reshuffle was good. Regardless of who you support in all of this.

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