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FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

fromjason.xyz

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Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well now we can put the speculation to rest, exactly how many CIA agents visited to shut down your radical operation??

The other option given the surprisingly one-sided list of protest movements they brag about: how many CIA agents were involved in its genesis?

this is valid, the fbi had anom for drug dealers

https://hachyderm.io/@josephcox@infosec.exchange/11232112693...

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#93
post #50

Hi there, I am on developement team of Newnode, a successor of FireChat founded by two of the same people ( https://www.newnode.com/ ). We now provide both, a VPN and a Messenger, with purpose to help people evade censorship and enable device-to-device connectivity. You can find the source code at https://github.com/clostra/newnode

I'm just curious, why not build ontop of another app like Signal?[0] My understanding is that there's nothing stopping anyone from using the same app and creating their own server and nodes. My understanding is that you can even hook into multiple nodes with a custom fork of the app. Wouldn't this give a big advantage of not requiring people to have a whole new app and you can work synergistically with a company with…

Not up, but most of the times it is a lot easier to build something from scratch. Signal is notoriously hard extend and use - they have a lot of custom tech. I gave up looking through their documentation. Now, the reason is that they actually have end-to-end encryption and most do not implement it in a secure and nice way. They basically had to build everything from scratch themselves.

TLDR it is often harder to reuse

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#94
post #61
post #50

Hi there, I am on developement team of Newnode, a successor of FireChat founded by two of the same people ( https://www.newnode.com/ ). We now provide both, a VPN and a Messenger, with purpose to help people evade censorship and enable device-to-device connectivity. You can find the source code at https://github.com/clostra/newnode

Is it open source? Will it one day mysteriously disappear from the internet too?

Why the snark? Even if it disappeared, that's better than never existing (helping people) at all.

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#95
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not exactly. Briar uses bluetooth or wifi when peers are close, but also tor (over standard internet) when not, so it's possible to use it at wide scale. Briar actually does set up a meshnet for groups and forums, so long as people are contacts of each other. See the diagram here: https://briarproject.org/img/howitworks3(mobile).svg

I would think that a meshnet only over contacts would have too many holes to really be helpful in the hypothetical protest setting that's being described. Definitely a cool way to do it! Do you happen to know if it's XMPP or something, or it's own protocol?

No, they're using their own protocol: https://code.briarproject.org/briar/briar/-/wikis/home

There are still holes of course, connecting only to contacts limits the spread of messages but ensures you don't leak too much information if your device is compromised

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#96

> Then, one day in February 2020, as COVID-19 swept the globe, access to FireChat was completely cut off without explanation. If it could be shut off from one place like that, it doesn't sound very "decentralized". Anyway, are there significant obstacles to re-implementation? Someone above mentioned an alternative that uses LoRa. That's nice but it sounds like the attraction of Firechat was that it used ordinary phon…

Once you realize that the ability to update code, obviously, negates any advantage "end-to-end encryption" brings, or any other form of security, you'll quickly find there is not a single secure messenger.

This is an argument I've never been able to successfully make to anyone except a military colonel.

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#97
post #29
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"just know who to trust". a super power I wish I had.

A revolution is all about subterfuge, intelligence, and trust. If you don't hone those skills, you might not be suited for one. Conversely, technology is an attack vector.

Not really, for example, the current one is about money:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qatari_involvement_in_higher_e...

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

It's not like the US recently saw protestors snatched off the streets in unmarked vans by unidentified forces [1]... or protestors designated terrorists by officials [2]... or widespread deployment of military surveillance on peaceful protestors... [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/17/us/portland-protests.html [2] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/28/copy-city-at...

It's not like anyone minds that when it is actually serious:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68840881

In fact there's protests happening all over that seek to PROTECT the people who do this. And it's not like this is the first time THIS WEEK this happened. Also they're still holding several European academics to get the terrorist who killed several hundred people attacking the Bataclan in Paris and Brussels airport freed. In fact they keep claiming they're about to execute the first of those academics.

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#99
post #50

Hi there, I am on developement team of Newnode, a successor of FireChat founded by two of the same people ( https://www.newnode.com/ ). We now provide both, a VPN and a Messenger, with purpose to help people evade censorship and enable device-to-device connectivity. You can find the source code at https://github.com/clostra/newnode

I think the obvious question is: can you shed any light or provide context on why the service was shut down? And if not, it seems unrealistic to expect people to adopt / trust your alternative.

The timeline is possibly informative.

Re: FireChat was a tool for revolution, then disappeared

#100

If you really want a chat tool to start a revolution, meet in person with people you trust and don't bring any electronic devices with you. And only talk to people who you really trust. Forget phones.

It was quite remarkable how Jan 6 proceeded entirely in the open with people posting selfies of themselves saying "off to overthrow the government today!", but because that kind of thing is entirely normalized from rightwing sources it wasn't important until those arrested eventually made it to court.

Stochastic terror and the stochastic coup work great precisely because there are no clear unambiguous two-way communication trails between the instigator and the accomplices; just a lot of "wouldn't it be great if somebody did something". Fell apart afterwards because there was no further planning.

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