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Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

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Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#91

Post by sgift »

phone8675309 wrote: post #57
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 10% would be considered an extremely high death rate for soldiers involved in the fighting. Even 2.5% for healthcare workers is ridiculously high. Hamas based their operations where conventional rules of war prohibit fire. That makes comparing casualty rates incredibly difficult. (To my knowledge, nobody else has done this so comprehensively. Though given its success, I expect it to be emulated. Which unfortunately…

> Hamas based their operations where conventional rules of war prohibit fire. This has not stopped the IDF

Yes, and if you look up the rules of war you will see that if you base your operations there the enemy is allowed to attack it. Besides a desire to not kill your civilian population that's another reason countries don't do that. But Hamas doesn't care for civilians.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#92

Post by usrnm »

jncfhnb wrote: post #48
Gabriel54 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suppose I am a country at war with the United States. Do I have the right to kill every American journalist? Also, it is not clear what "working in Hamas" means since they formed the government of the Gaza strip, so people "working in Hamas" would include all public officials, civil servants, etc. Does Israel have the right to kill all the sanitation workers of the Gaza strip since they also "work in Hamas"?

The rules of war are completely out the door when one side routinely pretends to be civilian, which is a war crime. Which is not to say it’s just to go committing whichever crimes you want, but discussing legal rights is largely pointless because it is immediately a lawless war.

By that same logic, fighting crime should not be bound by any laws. After all, criminals break the law by definition so it's perfectly ok to not respect the law when you're fighting them, right?

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#93

Post by eeeehhh »

ciconia wrote: post #25

> Around 10% of Gaza's journalists have been killed versus 2.5% of healthcare workers. One possible explanation is that journalists have a much higher probability of being close to where the fighting is, than healthcare workers.

This explaination wouldn't explain why the figure is so much higher than when compared to other conflicts in the world.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#94

Post by CommanderData »

hersko wrote: post #80

[flagged]

Killing Journalists is bad.

.. Then bombing their innocent families homes is bad.

We should talk about bad things paid for by our taxes and supported by us indirectly.

Discussion on Reddit+HN shutdown/down voted by organized Zionist groups. Also bad.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#95

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

nsguy wrote: post #61
hmcq6 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is unfounded. I'm still waiting on a single shred of evidence to drop about the AP building from 2-3 years ago https://apnews.com/article/israel-middle-east-business-israe... > Which unfortunately means prohibitions on bombing hospitals, schools and places of worship are now obsolete. Even if Hamas was fighting from hospitals and schools that is not how this works. Israel would be required to give those schools…

Israel has ordered hospitals to evacuate, e.g.: https://healthpolicy-watch.news/who-calls-for-israel-to-resc... I think you're generally wrong on the "they have not been doing" comment. Israel has been giving warnings, and those warnings were intentionally being ignored to maximize the damage to Israel's reputation. But if you have some comprehensive data here I'd be interested in seeing it. From my observation the p…

if Russia says that everyone in the UK has to leave the UK that doesn't give them the right to bomb every hospital in the UK

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#96

Post by ars »

moshun wrote: post #32

For context, a total of 69 journalists were killed in WWII, 63 in the Vietnam war both of which lasted several years. As of today March 6th 2024, the Gaza invasion has left 86 journalists dead in less than 4 months. That is an amazingly high percentage for the expected mean in a conflict. Sources: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2024/israel... https://www.icij.org/inside-icij/2024/02/over-75-of-all-j…

And for comparison 715 were killed in Syria.

"Of the 715, the Syrian regime was responsible for the killing of 553 journalists, including five children, one woman, five foreign journalists, and 47 journalists who died due to torture, while 24 journalists were killed at the hands of Russian forces."

https://snhr.org/blog/2023/05/03/on-world-press-freedom-day-...

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#97

Post by blast »

bkirkby wrote: post #74
g-b-r wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://cpj.org/2024/03/journalist-casualties-in-the-israel-... is a good independent source to get started (see also https://cpj.org/2024/03/attacks-arrests-threats-censorship-t... )

there appears to be no effort by cpj to determine if the journalists were killed by palestinians or israelis. is that accurate?

All the examples I looked at say killed by Israeli airstrike or Israeli sniper.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#98

Post by CommanderData »

ryanwhitney wrote: post #59

Noting that Israel already had a history of killing well-identified journalists outside of direct conflict; and lying about it: https://forensic-architecture.org/investigation/shireen-abu-... Here's a wider review from the Committee to Protect Journalists that predates the current conflict: https://cpj.org/reports/2023/05/deadly-pattern-20-journalist...

[flagged]

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#99

Post by pvg »

boringg wrote: post #66
moshun wrote: post #32

For context, a total of 69 journalists were killed in WWII, 63 in the Vietnam war both of which lasted several years. As of today March 6th 2024, the Gaza invasion has left 86 journalists dead in less than 4 months. That is an amazingly high percentage for the expected mean in a conflict. Sources: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2024/israel... https://www.icij.org/inside-icij/2024/02/over-75-of-all-j…

That may be true but a couple things have changed since those very dated sample points. (1) Definition of journalist (2) quantity of journalists (3) willingness to be on the very front lines in order to get better stories (4) technology enabling journalists thus being able to be more dangerous spots. (5) speculation -> journalists who are using press credentials as cover I'm neither way on the conflict but want to co…

Yes if you google 'how many journalists died in WW2' in Russian you get numbers from a couple of hundred to over a thousand for the Soviet Union alone. The 69 number listed at https://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/30/world/middleeast/30embed.... is almost certainly just US journalists.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#100

Post by psunavy03 »

phone8675309 wrote: post #57
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 10% would be considered an extremely high death rate for soldiers involved in the fighting. Even 2.5% for healthcare workers is ridiculously high. Hamas based their operations where conventional rules of war prohibit fire. That makes comparing casualty rates incredibly difficult. (To my knowledge, nobody else has done this so comprehensively. Though given its success, I expect it to be emulated. Which unfortunately…

> Hamas based their operations where conventional rules of war prohibit fire. This has not stopped the IDF

Protected sites lose their protected status under the law of armed conflict if they are used to hide/support combatants. Agree or disagree with Israel's targeting policies; that's still the law and has been for decades.
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