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Write code for the web

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Re: Write code for the web

#91

Post by mnvrth »

jahewson wrote: post #62
mark_l_watson wrote: post #28

I like the author's healthy attitude towards large corporations - basic modern survival skill. If I had my way, I would not have to install any apps on my iPhone or iPads but platform limitations make this a requirement. I noticed that on Safari, the X/Twitter web app is not playing videos, even after I turned off Lockdown Mode for X. Is this Apple's fault for a platform inconsistency or X trying to force users to in…

> ClojureScript + Dart Ignore people who write about finding the perfect stack. The perfect stack does not exist and it is not requisite for shipping great software that real users value. Much of web development consists of knowing the browser well, and web.dev is a great resource for that. Beyond that just go and learn React + TypeScript, the new react.dev is great. While React is not perfect it’s such a good paradi…

I would second that. Frameworks are secondary. React + TypeScript was the key (for me at least). After that it is just learning web standards - starting with CSS, HTML, JS - and then moving on to Canvas, WebAudio etc if one desires.

Re: Write code for the web

#92

Post by bowsamic »

Unfortunately from a non-professional perspective, writing for the web is just soul crushingly boring and honestly depressing. I'd rather not be reminded that this is where the cross-platform development takes place. It genuinely makes me hate programming and I find negative joy in it

Re: Write code for the web

#93

Post by smoldesu »

djbusby wrote: post #88
sspiff wrote: post #69

>The dependency goes Developer -> Apple and Apple -> Consumer, there is no reverse arrow from Apple to the developers. Is that really true? If Apple is abandoned by large developers (let's say of Adobe, Microsoft calibre), does it not harm their sales or revenue? It certainly isn't universally true. For young or new platforms, like the transition to ARM a few years ago, or the Vision Pro today, Apple needs developer…

Apple can make a new thing, while others (and the web) are playing catch-up. There are no open-standards for this VR road (yet (a-frame?)). These vendors will continue to "innovative" on their closed platforms.

> There are no open-standards for this VR road

There's a few, actually. WebXR is supported by Safari but coverage is supposedly really weak: https://www.roadtovr.com/apple-vision-pro-webxr-support-safa...

There's also OpenXR for native applications, which the Vision Pro does not cover. That's where the closed-platform "innovation" is happening, supposedly.

Re: Write code for the web

#94

Post by chilmers »

host0 wrote: post #45
ahmedfromtunis wrote: post #15

Early on, I made the choice to not to invest in learning native mobile development. I focused all my limited time on the web, and I think that, for once, I made the right choice. Today, one can build amazing stuff for the browser. And, in my very humble opinion, the vast majority of apps should've been WebApps — except for maybe Uber, Google Drive, and games. I worked in the journalism business, and, in my country, t…

PWAs, especially those built with an offline-first approach, are so much closer to the native experience than those from half a decade ago. However what concerns me is Google's and Apple's incentives to help them get better to a point where they can rival native apps which could hit their bottom line.

The nice thing about the web is that while it’s no company’s favoured platform, it’s valuable to all of them as a way into each other’s platforms. That’s why whoever is “winning” the platform war a particular point tends to neglect the web. See Microsoft in the 2000s, and Apple now. But all their competitors are incentivised to push the web forward, because it’s a useful fallback as a way to get their apps into the walled garden. Then, eventually things shift and the company that was dominating falls behind a bit, or is facing antitrust problems, and suddenly they care about the web again. In that way, the web is a perpetual underdog, but never goes away.

Re: Write code for the web

#95

Post by dickersnoodle »

px43 wrote: post #76
maxlamb wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you meant Google's and Apple's incentives to make them (PWAs) worse...

My understanding is that there is a lot of political power inside Google (from the Chrome side of things) working to ensure that PWAs are the primary way that users interact with their phones. It's definitely a point of contention, with pressure on both sides, but there is a balance there. Apple on the other hand is only incentivized to funnel everyone through their App Store, and for some ridiculous reason, app deve…

One really good thing about native apps versus PWAs is that once the user installs a native app and learns the way it works they don't need to learn it again until they upgrade. With anything sourced from the web, the user is at the mercy of the wevdevs, who are at the mercy of the marketing and merchandising wizards who want to shake up the UI to try and goad users into buying more stuff. It's kind of like those round baskets that supermarkets like to clutter the aisles with; somehow they think it prompts you to buy things, but for me it adds one more product to my "no, not buying this ever again" list.

Re: Write code for the web

#96

Post by motoxpro »

bmitc wrote: post #51
hnfong wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I tried developing on , actively avoided using their tools and tech, and the experience sucked because nothing I tried was supported."

It wasn't that it was not supported. It is that Apple is openly antagonistic to and actively blocks anything that isn't theirs. And you also left out key information. I don't have any issues with the same development on Windows or Linux. Apple is the outlier and isn't doing some reasonable thing. Apple is by far the most troublesome platform to develop for. They literally make you do it their way, and you cannot reco…

I agree with the GP. I feel like you're trying to walk into a steakhouse and ask for pancakes KNOWING it was a steakhouse before you went in. Pancakes are great, but it says steakhouse right on the sign that says "We sell steak and nothing else"

Re: Write code for the web

#97

Post by javcasas »

coliveira wrote: post #27

Writing for the web would be great if you didn't have to learn a new framework every six weeks because people will not stop coming with new ways to do the same thing over and over again.

Just go with react bro... Now seriously, React has been working fine for 10 years. If you need to chase something different every 6 months, I'm inclined to say you are doing something wrong.

Re: Write code for the web

#98

Post by noSyncCloud »

Someone wrote: post #14
romanovcode wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still can't figure out how to format on save in Xcode. Or format in general?

> Or format in general? I use the workaround of Command-A, command-X, command-V aka “Select All, Cut, Paste”. Unfortunately that loses cursor position in the file and gives you a free newline at the end of your content.

You're supposed to end your document with a newline. That's a POSIX standard.

Re: Write code for the web

#99

Post by aCoreyJ »

maxlamb wrote: post #54
host0 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PWAs, especially those built with an offline-first approach, are so much closer to the native experience than those from half a decade ago. However what concerns me is Google's and Apple's incentives to help them get better to a point where they can rival native apps which could hit their bottom line.

I think you meant Google's and Apple's incentives to make them (PWAs) worse...

Google is the one pushing them. Apple has the incentive to keep people on the device though because they don't have an advertising business

https://fugu-tracker.web.app/

Re: Write code for the web

#100

Post by mnvrth »

chilmers wrote: post #94
host0 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PWAs, especially those built with an offline-first approach, are so much closer to the native experience than those from half a decade ago. However what concerns me is Google's and Apple's incentives to help them get better to a point where they can rival native apps which could hit their bottom line.

The nice thing about the web is that while it’s no company’s favoured platform, it’s valuable to all of them as a way into each other’s platforms. That’s why whoever is “winning” the platform war a particular point tends to neglect the web. See Microsoft in the 2000s, and Apple now. But all their competitors are incentivised to push the web forward, because it’s a useful fallback as a way to get their apps into the w…

Wow, that's a great way of putting it! Thanks, I had never linked the dots that way before.
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