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Krita AI Diffusion

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Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#91

Post by makeitdouble »

raincole wrote: post #19
hafriedlander wrote: post #8

Somewhat tangential, but the Krita community and core team have been pretty explicitly anti-AI. https://krita-artists.org/t/change-in-policy-for-topics-rela... (I am part of a group that builds UI on top of open models, but we stopped working on our Krita version for that reason.)

I think at one point Krita will fork to two apps because of this exact reason. AI-based tools are clearly the next step of painting apps (to me at least, but I can't be the only one who believes in this). I think in 3~5 years an painting app without AI generation feature is just like a painting app without pen pressure today. It's still usable, you can make great art with it if you have the skill, but it will be so o…

Is it that different from how we view Github copilot ?

As far as I know there's a sizeable number of devs who don't intend to ever rely on copilot, and I would expect the a similar trend in the drawing community with amateurs and pros not specially anti-AI, but not wanting to have a random generator meddle with their art.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#92

Post by vouaobrasil »

greatpatton wrote: post #90
vouaobrasil wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with many technophiles is that they have a very distorted view of what they create. They often think it's going to do good because it's so cool but once that tech is out in the real world, it just mostly causes damage. If you're interested, feel free to reach out to me because I am starting an anti-AI coalition.

Out of curiosity can you just give me pratical example of: "it's so cool but once that tech is out in the real world, it just mostly causes damage."

Well:

(1) AI has already been used for IDENTIY THEFT in many places. Check this out: https://www.businessinsider.com/ai-scam-voice-clone-fake-kid...

AI here to clone a voice was used to make a mother think her daughter had been kidnapped

(2) People getting fired from their jobs such as illustrators because AI can now do things. Also, people NOT getting hired when they could.

(3) I am a professional writer, and I know of some websites who are using generative AI for articles and hiring less (or even firing writers)

(4) AI removes what remaining reliance we have on each other and makes it less likely for people to talk to each other when needing some basic information. The societal effects of destroying communities where people need each other are pretty clear.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#93

Post by bArray »

bArray wrote: post #61

Trying it now and will update later (as a comment), takes a little while to download and install. One note about the installation on Ubuntu is that you need to install Krita first, run it, and then copy the plug-in to the desired folder - otherwise there is nowhere to copy it to.

Tested on a NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3050 under Ubuntu with 4GB VRAM. Initially tried with a 4Kx4K canvas size, but it seems too much and fails. I lowered the canvas to 2Kx2K and it seems to just about be okay.

My test prompt (to compare against other models):

> (masterpiece, best quality), a giant made of rock, highly detailed, rock texture

For Cinematic Photo XL this produces a picture of rocks. For Digital Artwork XL I get a nice scene with a complex rock structure. Both take about two minutes.

It seems to work well and the integration into Krita seems quite nice. The settings are suitably simple, but would be nice if more was exposed in an advanced window or something.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#94

Post by ben_w »

vouaobrasil wrote: post #80
ben_w wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AI is a tool that is and always will make the creation of art less a matter of the expression of the human soul I firmly disagree. I have a very strong imagination, but I never had time (and still don't have the time between full-time work and needing to learn German) to develop the skills to turn what I can imagine into artefacts that others can enjoy by my own hand . AI gives me the means to turn some of what I i…

So I suppose your need to create AI diversions is more important than the need of others to feel a sense of purpose through their work through their actual talent that you don't have? Good thing you have a full-time job.... Big Tech will benefit immensely from AI. Even if Stable Diffusion is free, it will spurn the development of new computers and new technology to run models like Stable Diffusion, so even not immedi…

> So I suppose your need to create AI diversions is more important than the need of others to feel a sense of purpose through their work through their actual talent that you don't have?

Not so. Sense of purpose is important.

Your sense of purpose conflicts with the opportunity of everyone else to express themselves as they wish.

How familiar are you with utilitarian ethics, and the "mere addition paradox" criticism of it? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mere_addition_paradox

> Good thing you have a full-time job....

For now. The LLMs will come/are coming for mine, just as diffusion models and GANs eat at the jobs of graphical artists.

> Fully automated luxury communism is a rather bleak future, and it will take us away from being stewards of the environment, and instead consume as many resources as possible.

It's (currently) pure Utopianism, taking on whatever hopes the proponents want it to have no matter how unrealistic. I therefore think you're arguing on the basis of which team it's associated with, without understanding the details of what it is you hate.

> Finally, even if you are doing something relatively harmless with Stable Diffisuion, many other people will use AI for malicious purposes.

Oh absolutely. Whole can of worms there.

Can say the same about basically every tech way back to the wheel, fire, and pointy stick, though unlike most using this analogy I am well aware of the problem of induction (in particular the turkey and the farmer), and don't claim that it will all work out just because it has so far.

AI in general could make us immortal, with lives of leisure and free from all suffering… or it could turn us all into paperclips to maximise shareholder value.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#95

Post by hutzlibu »

makeitdouble wrote: post #91
raincole wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think at one point Krita will fork to two apps because of this exact reason. AI-based tools are clearly the next step of painting apps (to me at least, but I can't be the only one who believes in this). I think in 3~5 years an painting app without AI generation feature is just like a painting app without pen pressure today. It's still usable, you can make great art with it if you have the skill, but it will be so o…

Is it that different from how we view Github copilot ? As far as I know there's a sizeable number of devs who don't intend to ever rely on copilot, and I would expect the a similar trend in the drawing community with amateurs and pros not specially anti-AI, but not wanting to have a random generator meddle with their art.

"As far as I know there's a sizeable number of devs who don't intend to ever rely on copilot"

Is that really a thing?

I mean, I also don't want to rely on Microsoft and therefore also not on Copilot, but not using AI tools in general out of principle is probably a very rare minority. I simply would prefer my own local LLM.

But in the thread linked above I read "AI never had and never will have it’s place in art." And this stance would be very weird for me for devs.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#96

Post by ben_w »

vonjuice wrote: post #69
ben_w wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mm. Possibly, but not necessarily. I have a suspicion that art is to humans as fancy tails are to peacocks: the difficulty is the point. I believe this is why we have art galleries proudly displaying oil paintings of fruit bowls, but don't do this for random food snapshots. It's also why photographs as a category were initially dismissed (in an era that had come to praise extreme realism in paintings), but when photo…

We have art galleries displaying things like empty canvases or toilet bowls that make a statement, it's definitely not about difficulty. The fact is that the debate about what art is is part of what makes art art, it escapes definition because part of the spirit of art is rebelling against definition.

Mm.

I'm 50-50 split on thinking I regard that kind of art as a vehicle for tax evasion, vs. thinking the "difficulty" is the money wasted on it (which is still Veblen "look at me I'm rich I can waste money on something pointless").

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#97

Post by gumballindie »

thot_experiment wrote: post #13
hafriedlander wrote: post #8

Somewhat tangential, but the Krita community and core team have been pretty explicitly anti-AI. https://krita-artists.org/t/change-in-policy-for-topics-rela... (I am part of a group that builds UI on top of open models, but we stopped working on our Krita version for that reason.)

The AI hate is suuuch a meme in the art community, it's very frustrating/alienating. (Though understandably, neoliberal capitalism is also extremely frustrating, so I see why artists mad, I just wish they'd be mad at the root cause.) ((the root cause is that an economic system fundamentally based on scarcity == value doesn't make sense when applied to things that are essentially infinite, and kludgeing in artificial…

Is it though? Veryone I know in the art community is quite pissed at copyright violations.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#98

Post by greatpatton »

vouaobrasil wrote: post #92
greatpatton wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity can you just give me pratical example of: "it's so cool but once that tech is out in the real world, it just mostly causes damage."

Well: (1) AI has already been used for IDENTIY THEFT in many places. Check this out: https://www.businessinsider.com/ai-scam-voice-clone-fake-kid... AI here to clone a voice was used to make a mother think her daughter had been kidnapped (2) People getting fired from their jobs such as illustrators because AI can now do things. Also, people NOT getting hired when they could. (3) I am a professional writer, and I know…

Ok but that can be said of any technology. Chemistry is bad because someone used it to poison their friend. Phones are bad because it can be used for bomb threats, cars are bad because they put out of work the whole horse industry and you can go on and on forever. Every single technology can be abused but it doesn't mean that they mainly cause damage.

Re: Krita AI Diffusion

#99

Post by ben_w »

amelius wrote: post #68
ben_w wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mm. Possibly, but not necessarily. I have a suspicion that art is to humans as fancy tails are to peacocks: the difficulty is the point. I believe this is why we have art galleries proudly displaying oil paintings of fruit bowls, but don't do this for random food snapshots. It's also why photographs as a category were initially dismissed (in an era that had come to praise extreme realism in paintings), but when photo…

> the difficulty is the point Ok, so what does the next level of "difficult" look like?

Right now, I'd guess engineering and growing custom life forms, like The Thought Emporium is doing. Not sure how long that will last for.
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