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Brave Search launches own image and video search

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Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#91

Post by pierrefar »

jaharios wrote: post #85
pierrefar wrote: post #71

The major problem with Brave search is their position about indexing and licensing content against the wishes of the website publisher. Their robot does not identify itself, meaning the publisher cannot use the standard robots.txt to block its crawling if the publisher so wishes. Incidentally, the robots.txt file has been used in court cases litigating if a search engine is legal or not. Even worse, they state that B…

This make me want to use Brave search now. When I use a tool I expect it that it serves me, not the material it provides. > A publisher should have full control to discriminate which search engine indexes the website's content If you want someone to not see what you publish block him yourself. Also why would you want to do that? Do you want google to own the web or something?

There is a a difference between a human being able to access content vs a search engine indexing it (and in the case of Brave, "licensing" it on).

I share your concern about Google having this much power, and I'd add that Microsoft Bing is equally bad but gets away with it because they're smaller. Still, the final decision about which search engine indexes a website is purely the publisher's.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#92

Post by Terretta »

MildRant wrote: post #59
SomeoneOnTheWeb wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shouldn't Kagi ( https://kagi.com ) also be on that list?

Someone will correct me if I'm wrong but Kagi uses Google search results. I'm sure it's more complicated than that and they have their own secret sauce but it is not an independent search engine. See: https://help.kagi.com/kagi/why-kagi/kagi-vs-google.html

> Someone will correct me if I'm wrong but Kagi uses Google search results.

Click two links down in the same menu:

https://help.kagi.com/kagi/why-kagi/kagi-vs-brave.html

Kagi Search includes anonymized requests to traditional search indexes like Google and Bing as well as sources like Wikipedia, DeepL, and other APIs. We also have our own non-commercial index (Teclis), news index (TinyGem), and an AI for instant answers. Teclis and TinyGem are a result of our crawl through millions of domains, focusing primarily on non-commercial, high-quality content.

Our unique results combined from all of these sources help you discover the best content you can possibly find online, sometimes from the quieter places on the web.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#93

Post by [deleted] »

mg wrote: post #34

As far as I can tell, that makes for 5 independent image search engines on the web: Baidu Bing Brave Google Yandex You can compare their results on this search comparison page I maintain: https://www.gnod.com/search/?engines=p,o,br,n,q&nw=1 (If you want to also search image libraries like Flickr and Pexels, click on "more engines" to select all places you want to search)

[deleted]

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#94

Post by cvalka »

pierrefar wrote: post #71

The major problem with Brave search is their position about indexing and licensing content against the wishes of the website publisher. Their robot does not identify itself, meaning the publisher cannot use the standard robots.txt to block its crawling if the publisher so wishes. Incidentally, the robots.txt file has been used in court cases litigating if a search engine is legal or not. Even worse, they state that B…

They are right and you are wrong. If some web page is publicly available, it should be indexed. Scraping neutrality, please.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#95

Post by cvalka »

pierrefar wrote: post #88
CaptainFever wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m just thinking that if website publishers are able to legally allow Googlebot but block other bots, it might contribute to the Google monopoly.

That would be bad, and it is already bad that Google and Microsoft control so much of search queries, but the decision about which search engine indexes a website is purely the publisher's.

No, it's not.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#96

Post by yreg »

pierrefar wrote: post #88
CaptainFever wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m just thinking that if website publishers are able to legally allow Googlebot but block other bots, it might contribute to the Google monopoly.

That would be bad, and it is already bad that Google and Microsoft control so much of search queries, but the decision about which search engine indexes a website is purely the publisher's.

But why do you believe so?

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#97

Post by MildRant »

Terretta wrote: post #92
MildRant wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone will correct me if I'm wrong but Kagi uses Google search results. I'm sure it's more complicated than that and they have their own secret sauce but it is not an independent search engine. See: https://help.kagi.com/kagi/why-kagi/kagi-vs-google.html

> Someone will correct me if I'm wrong but Kagi uses Google search results. Click two links down in the same menu: https://help.kagi.com/kagi/why-kagi/kagi-vs-brave.html Kagi Search includes anonymized requests to traditional search indexes like Google and Bing as well as sources like Wikipedia, DeepL, and other APIs. We also have our own non-commercial index (Teclis), news index (TinyGem), and an AI for instant answ…

I would say using Google and Bing makes it not independent but they could invest in further developing their own index if they wanted to go independent.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#98

Post by soundnote »

reitanqild wrote: post #80
soundnote wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mind Mozilla trying to find alternate revenue sources 0%. It's a good thing: Organizations like Mozilla and Brave SHOULD be making their own money and not be stuck to the Google teat. Mozilla doesn't go about it in as upfront way as Brave does, IME, but stuff like VPN, Pocket and other browser-related services I mind not at all. I have no sympathy to the current political shitfest that Mozilla is as an organization…

I also think it is great that browsers seek out alternative sources of funding. My problems with Mozilla are: - Misuse of money: the browser team have brought in lots of money over the years (we talk billions) and the foundation is milking it dry. If the income created by the browser had stayed with the browser team they would have had funding for years to come. - Being dishonest: Mozilla has sought donations for Fir…

> they more or less lied about their relationship with Pocket.

Can you elaborate? I don't really remember much about those kinds of things.

> - Nerfing the extension API.

This I think was necessary if you want a modern, secure browser. Wouldn't be against a more extensive extension API that double-checked with the user wrt access to more dangerous permissions, which is partly what the current ones do already.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#99

Post by soundnote »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #83
soundnote wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mind Mozilla trying to find alternate revenue sources 0%. It's a good thing: Organizations like Mozilla and Brave SHOULD be making their own money and not be stuck to the Google teat. Mozilla doesn't go about it in as upfront way as Brave does, IME, but stuff like VPN, Pocket and other browser-related services I mind not at all. I have no sympathy to the current political shitfest that Mozilla is as an organization…

Brave sees Mozilla's political shitfest and raises a political shitbacchanalia.

How so? If you're thinking about Eich's politics, those are/were HIS, not Brave or Mozilla the organization's. Brave the organization's politics are pretty narrow and what you'd want out of a browser: Privacy and user control.

Meanwhile Mozilla the organization boots people for politics, wants "more than deplatforming" and uses as one of their examples organizations deciding what I should see on the Internet - preferring outlets that Mozilla themselves like, naturally. They publish stuff with the gist of "did you encounter other politics on YouTube, how scary".

Meanwhile the organization spends money on getting a sneaker designer to make time-limited color themes for their browser and writes a pile of copy about how cool it is that a sneaker designer painted the browser blue.

https://imgur.com/a/ZmUzr0q

Meanwhile, Brave releases a user-customizable filtering function for their search engine so you, not someone else, can decide from what POV you see the Internet and added native vertical tabs to the browser.

One organization is blatantly political, the other just makes a good browser.

You can run a similar set of comparisons for Vivaldi, who are also clearly a much more product-focused organization and it shows. They have some more visible political leans as an org, but still far milder than Mozilla's, a lot of those leans being just being vehemently anti-crypto, with the biggest focus going to user control and privacy, as it should.

Re: Brave Search launches own image and video search

#100

Post by the_third_wave »

reitanqild wrote: post #74
magicalist wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Specially doesn't censor for political motives that I'm aware of What are the censored image searches you found?

Try to search for the 1989 Tiananmen Square protests and massacre. That tends to upset some engines including Bing I think.

I just did and found that Baidu is the only one to censor all images related to the protests and massacre. Bing may filter out these images when used in China (I tried searching in Chinese with the browser set to request Chinese-language results, this did not affect the search results) but it does not seem to do so for me (Sweden, Linux, Firefox).
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