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Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#91

Post by numbers_guy »

bmitc wrote: post #20
H8crilA wrote: post #4

At which point do you think humanity will start seriously thinking about radical solutions? Such as detonating thermonuclear weapons to throw enough dust above the troposphere to cool the planet down? I'm thinking we're still really far away. Migration from areas that become uninhabitable is still weak. And it doesn't look like any state that has substantial military/commercial/political power is interested in starti…

The "radical" solutions are not just throwing more technology at the problems. That's how we got ourselves into this mess in the first place. The solution is to stop mindless consumption. We use the same material to wrap and bake food and drink unhealthy drinks as we do to build airplanes. We use plastic for use cases that take place over seconds and minutes and then throw it away. We drive everywhere because of poor…

I agree in principle. The reason we are not doing this is because it would destroy the economy and when that happens basically everything falls apart. We would still have enough food and essentials for everyone but loads of people would be without jobs and others would lose billions of wealth.

A fully green economy might be possible in the far future but the transition seems like it is going to take a century or more.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#92

Post by audessuscest »

croes wrote: post #21
audessuscest wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

17° this morning in Kiev ;)

World hunger is on the rise. I'm full, 8 o'clock in Paris.

> leaving earth in uncharted territory

"uncharted" is the keyword here, do you understand what it really means?

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#93

Post by Ekaros »

I wonder if we should instead embrace the climate change. We know that no one will accept stopping rising standards of living or even lowering them. As such we are not going to emit less in long run.

Can we instead of make some changes on local level that effectively work with the climate change or minimise the impact? Might mean need to abandon some locations, but there has always been population movements.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#94

Post by _l4jh »

Anecdotal story time. We have a family villa in Spain about an hour and a half south of Alicante. We just got back from two weeks there like we do every year. The heat and humidity this time was the first time it was too much so that we didn’t enjoy our time there. We’ve had this place 21 years.

Yes it’s Spain and it’s always hot which is why we bought it but this year was something else. The mix of both very high temps (higher than usual for July) and much higher humidity just made it very uncomfortable. We don’t usually need the AC on in July but we had to run it every night this time to be able to sleep.

Even the pool wasn’t refreshing as it was a constant 33C whereas it is usually around 28-30.

On the Wednesday night just gone we also had a heat burst. My first experience with such a thing and wow that was something else. It was like opening an oven door. The blast of scorching hot air in my face was almost suffocating.

Of course there have always been outlier days that have been too damn hot over the past two decades but this time it was the whole two weeks. Not just the odd day. I dread to think that it will be like in August which is when the temps usually hit their highest.

I’m a simple software guy I don’t pretend to know much about the climate but I listen and when thousands of scientists present data that shows average temps going up it makes me worry. If things continue like this some areas just won’t be reasonable to live or visit. They’re just not comfortable. You have to stay indoors as the sun roasts you in minutes and the humidity just makes you feel like crap constantly.

Even our neighbours who live there are talking of moving as it isn’t a nice place to live anymore. You feel trapped indoors with AC and do all you can to avoid going outside.

If these kinds of temperatures do continue to rise as predicted there is going to be a huge relocation of people to more liveable locations which is going to be a whole other problem.

I live in [redacted] where we have hot temperatures in the summer but we have pretty good humidity and it rarely feels “too hot”. I have AC but almost never need to use it unless it climbs to around 40C for a few consecutive days so I am used to pretty hot but I just did not enjoy Spain these past two weeks and was so glad to arrive home last night to 29C.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#95

Post by uxcolumbo »

jgilias wrote: post #64
uxcolumbo wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This study[0] and several other studies by UN, Oxford Uni etc disagree with you. The single best thing an individual can do is immensely reduce or completely avoid meat and dairy. Imagine millions and millions of people doing this, behavioural change will trigger system’s change. It’s something we can do today, just need to decide whether having a burger is more important or not. [0] https://www.nature.com/articles/s…

The URL is not working, can you update it? The study probably explores what would happen if _everyone_ did that. And that’s the issue right there. Everyone casts a wide net, it includes climate deniers, poor people, rich people, hard core dairy aficionados, etc, etc. The single most important thing an individual can do is inducing systemic change in one way or another. Preferably somehow avoiding alienating the bulk…

I clicked it - It works.

There is also a link to the PDF - try this one: https://www.nature.com/articles/s43016-023-00795-w.pdf.

RE: The single most important thing an individual can do is inducing systemic change in one way or another.

And that was my point. Vote with your wallet and inform others in your circle that reducing / avoiding will have positive impact. This will trigger systemic change.

Is it the only thing we can do, no it's not, but it's something you and I can do right now.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#96

Post by numbers_guy »

ant6n wrote: post #87
numbers_guy wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If those policies were global it would be fair. Doing it only in Germany is just making the Germans poorer.

Germany as one of the richest nations, and one of the largest cumulative polluters, should be a role model here. If everybody needs to do it, somebody needs to start.

The role model nonsense, I never got that. How is that supposed to do anything.

As for the comparative wealth, I already earn 1/3 of what I would in the US, my home is smaller, I don't own a car and I have no A/C. And now I should also be taxed even more, while Americans who already pollute 10x as much keep doing as they please.

Fuck that. That's fucking unfair and I am not willing to do that.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#97

Post by vkou »

Ekaros wrote: post #93

I wonder if we should instead embrace the climate change. We know that no one will accept stopping rising standards of living or even lowering them. As such we are not going to emit less in long run. Can we instead of make some changes on local level that effectively work with the climate change or minimise the impact? Might mean need to abandon some locations, but there has always been population movements.

> Can we instead of make some changes on local level that effectively work with the climate change or minimise the impact?

We can always get our towns ready to receive the millions of climate refugees we'll be creating.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#98

Post by uxcolumbo »

anonzzzies wrote: post #59
uxcolumbo wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This study[0] and several other studies by UN, Oxford Uni etc disagree with you. The single best thing an individual can do is immensely reduce or completely avoid meat and dairy. Imagine millions and millions of people doing this, behavioural change will trigger system’s change. It’s something we can do today, just need to decide whether having a burger is more important or not. [0] https://www.nature.com/articles/s…

> Imagine millions and millions of people doing this But they won't. Even here on HN, where some smart people roam, touching their meat (like, eating LESS of it, not quitting altogether) will make them into incoherent angry (I guess) men. And that's of course a big step, smaller steps are even not a thing for many people; not flying, no car, hell, here people even refuse to obey the law of not topping up (or filling)…

Yes true, but we have to keep trying to convince people in our circles. Otherwise we're effed.

I would have hoped that especially this HN crowd would change their mind because it's quite clear and logical that not consuming meat and dairy will mean requiring fewer resources and producing less pollution.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#99

Post by uxcolumbo »

WithinReason wrote: post #81
uxcolumbo wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This study[0] and several other studies by UN, Oxford Uni etc disagree with you. The single best thing an individual can do is immensely reduce or completely avoid meat and dairy. Imagine millions and millions of people doing this, behavioural change will trigger system’s change. It’s something we can do today, just need to decide whether having a burger is more important or not. [0] https://www.nature.com/articles/s…

I everyone in the world adopted a vegan diet CO2 emissions would drop by 13%. Still eating pork, poultry, eggs and fish would reduce it by 8.6%: https://ourworldindata.org/carbon-opportunity-costs-food

It's not just about CO2 - it's also that the large scale meat & dairy industry requires way more resources, destroys natural habitats and creates a ton of pollution.

Re: Climate records tumble, leaving Earth in uncharted territory – scientists

#100

Post by osullip »

Ekaros wrote: post #93

I wonder if we should instead embrace the climate change. We know that no one will accept stopping rising standards of living or even lowering them. As such we are not going to emit less in long run. Can we instead of make some changes on local level that effectively work with the climate change or minimise the impact? Might mean need to abandon some locations, but there has always been population movements.

That's a good point.

We are not turning back the systems that will heat the world.

If we approach it as a local challenge, there is a chance we can invent new ways to deal with it.

Maybe instead of this being the end, it could be a beginning of new science and development that counters the negative impacts of change.

Maybe, just maybe, we can get some good out of it.

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