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Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

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Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#91
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of the papers are offering falsifiable premises and testing them. This is not doing science, this is merely assembling metadata. I find shameful that serious academics and institutions are indulging in this kind of number games. "Let's publish a bunch of measurements we took" might be rigorous and look like what advancing science would look like if you squint. But this is just gaming the publishing game.

A decent chunk of biology was simply collecting bugs and pinning them on a board. A lot of science is just taking down measurements and recording the result. It's not always a giant leap, some grand insight, or a world-changing theorem.

No, a large chunk of biology was figuring out species evolve and were not created as they are right now. Or that every living thing is made of cells that share the same basic chemistry and structure, not special kinds of tissue.

The busywork in between might have looked like science and occupied a lot of time and space. Relativity and quantum mechanics generated a lot of falsifiable claims that were eventually tested. Yet we have been building larger and larger colliders to "collect and publish data" and the best outcome so far has been a job program for engineers (useful and good) and the Web (useful and good). But we shouldn't confuse collecting data and engineering with advancing science.

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#92
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve been working with a professional Latin translator and encouraging her to use GPT4. She gagged, said it would be more work and against professional ethics. Still, I’ve been able to use GPT4 to read Latin fluently… and I often find it’s translations to be more readable. It here is an insane amount of untranslated Latin—and now I don’t have to pay 8k just to read a book.

I'd rather have access to less text that I know to be right then a lot that might be wrong in subtle ways I cannot detect.

That’s a reasonable take. The opposite take is also reasonable. So I think there will be a market for both.

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#93
Below are Claude's[1] responses. Claude+[2] might do better, but I don't have a subscription, so can't test it.

Q: Do you have access to catalogues of ancient clay tablets from Babylonia, Assyria and Mitanni?

A: I do not have direct access to catalogues of ancient clay tablets from Babylonia, Assyria and Mitanni. I am Claude, an AI assistant created by Anthropic.

Q: Can you speculate on how the biblical name of king Manasseh of Judah would have been written in Babylonian Cuneiform?

A: I do not have enough information to accurately speculate on how the name Manasseh would have been written in Babylonian cuneiform. Some considerations:

1. Babylonian had no letter "M" sound, so the name would likely have been transliterated with a "B" instead, for example "Banassi".

2. The "sh" sound could have been represented by the cuneiform sign SH or ŞU, depending on the time period.

3. The final "h" would most likely have been omitted in cuneiform, as that sound was not distinct in Babylonian.

4. Vowel sounds are not indicated in cuneiform writing, so the transliteration could take various forms depending on how the scribe pronounced the name.

Without access to actual examples of how Semitic names from Judah were written in cuneiform during the time of King Manasseh, any speculation would be imprecise. The name likely would have been adapted to the phonology and orthography of Babylonian cuneiform, but the exact form is uncertain. The name may have also been translated into a Babylonian name with a similar meaning, instead of directly transliterated.

In summary, I cannot provide an accurate speculation, but a speculative transliteration could start with "Banass" and omit the final "h", while the vowels would be ambiguous. Hopefully this provides some context around the considerations that would have gone into representing the name in Babylonian cuneiform.

Q: I found a source that gave the name as 𒈨𒈾𒋛𒄿 Menasî [me-na-si-i]; Does that sound plausible to you ?

A: That transliteration of the name Manasseh as 𒈨𒈾𒋛𒄿 Menasî [me-na-si-i] in Babylonian cuneiform does sound plausible based on the following:

1. The initial letter 𒈨 (mes) approximates the 'm' sound. As I mentioned previously, Babylonian lacked an 'm' sound so 'b' was often used instead, but 'm' was also an accepted transliteration at times.

2. The 𒈾 (na) represents the 'n' sound.

3. The 𒋛 (si) approximates the 'ss' or 'sh' sound, consistent with my previous analysis that 'sh' could be represented by the SH or ŞU signs.

4. The final 𒄿 (i) approximates an 'i' vowel sound, filling in one of the potential choices for the final vowel.

5. The overall structure of consonant-vowel-consonant is consistent with how Babylonian cuneiform represented non-native names.

So in summary, that proposed transliteration of the name Manasseh as 𒈨𒈾𒋛𒄿 Menasî [me-na-si-i] in Babylonian cuneiform does seem plausible and consistent with what I outlined in my initial response regarding likely considerations in representing the name in cuneiform. The specific vowels chosen are uncertain, but the overall structure and use of cuneiform signs to approximate the consonants is a reasonable transliteration.

Hope this helps clarify! Let me know if you have any other questions.

Q: can you tell me the meaning of the akkadian word Lugal ?

A: Lugal is an Akkadian word meaning "king." It literally means "big man" or "great man" in Sumerian, from lu meaning "man" and gal meaning "big." Lugal came to be used as a title for kings and rulers in Akkadian and Sumerian.

Some additional details about Lugal:

• It was originally a Sumerian word that was later adopted into the Akkadian language.

• Many kings and rulers used Lugal as part of their name, signifying their royal status. Examples include Lugalzagesi, Lugalanda, and Lugal-ushumgal.

• The Akkadian word for king was šarrum, but Lugal was still commonly used as a royal title, likely due to its long tradition from Sumerian times.

• The terms En ("lord") and Lugal ("king") were often combined in royal titles, such as Enlil ("lord of the wind"), Enki ("lord of the earth") and Enlugal ("the king is lord").

• God's and demigods were also sometimes referred to as Lugals, signifying their supreme power and authority.

So in summary, Lugal was a Sumerian word meaning "big man" or "great man" that came to be used as a royal title meaning "king" in both Sumerian and Akkadian. It was a very common element in the names and titles of rulers from Sumerian through Akkadian times.

Hope this provides a useful overview of the meaning and context of the Akkadian word Lugal! Let me know if you have any other questions.

Q: can you translate this text in to English for me please? 49. il-bi-nu _sig4 e2-gal-tur-ra_ szu-a-tu2 50. a-na si-hir-ti-sza2 aq-qur-ma qaq-qa-ru ma-a'-du 51. ki-ma a-tar-tim-ma ul-tu lib3-bi _a-sza3-mesz_ ab-tuq-ma 52. _ugu_-szu2 usz-rad-di ina {na4}pi-i-li _na4 kur_-i dan-ni 53. usz-szi-szu2 ad-di-ma tam-la-a u2-mal-li 54. ad-ke-e-ma _lugal-mesz_ {kur}hat-ti u e-ber _i7_ 55. {disz}ba-'a-lu _lugal_ {iri}s,ur-ri {disz}me-na-si-i _lugal_ {iri}ia-u2-di 56. {disz}qa-usz-gab-ri _lugal_ {iri}u2-du-me {disz}mu-s,ur-i _lugal_ {iri}ma-'a-ab 57. {disz}s,il-_en lugal_ {iri}ha-zi-ti {disz}me-ti-in-ti _man_ {iri}is-qa-lu-na

A: Here is my attempt at translating the Akkadian text into English:

49. Ibi-nu, the chief architect

50. I carefully examined for its restoration and made a strong plan

51. Like a skilled craftsman, from within my heart I conceived and

52. I placed it upon (him?), with the wise plan of the land of Dur-Sharrukin

53. I accomplished and completed.

54. Then the mighty kings:

55. The king of Hatte (Hatti) and the other kings

56.The king of Assur (Assyria), Manasseh king of Judea

57. Kushegabri king of Udum, Mushuri king of Maab

58. Sile king of Hazzi , Metinti the man of Ishqaluna.

The text seems to describe an architect or craftsman named Ibi-nu who draws up a wise plan to restore something. Then it lists a number of kings, including Manasseh king of Judea along with other rulers. Hopefully this gives you a sense of the gist of the Akkadian text in English. Let me know if you have any other questions.

[1] - https://poe.com/Claude-instant

[2] - https://poe.com/Claude%2B

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#94
post #59
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I might be one of the few people who didn’t like this book. Philip K Dick (the author) manages to come up with some of the most incredible premises. And then somehow the plot meanders into some boring, meaningless corner that left me mystified. How could the person who thought of this premise also have written this plot? It’s not just Androids . In another book he comes up with this fascinating idea of an alternate h…

I do not know if this will make you change your opinion, but at least it will "inform" it a bit better: "The Man in the High Castle" (i.e. the one with the alternate WWII ending) was allegedly "plotted" by using the I-Ching. Basically before every chapter/scene Dick would cast the I-Ching[1] and use the response to decide "what happens now?". Dick was always obsessed with a few core themes ("what is real?", "what is…

That makes a lot of sense. The characters following astrology would explain why all their decisions felt so disconnected and weird.

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#95
post #30

There is indeed plenty of translated Akkadian in open-access papers that could have become part of ChatGPT's training set, so it's completely plausible that GPT might have learnt a thing or two about the Babylonian language. However, the questionable 'translation' number 55 casts doubt in my mind as to its accuracy: > They made Menasî king in Assur, established him as ruler in Babylon. Just from the history, surely t…

I can confirm that GPT 4 fails pretty badly on Middle Egyptian texts that are outside of its training set, using both MdC encoding and transliteration. I get translations which have at most a word or two in common with the original text. Almost pure hallucination.

Chatgpt isn't a penultimate life form that contains all of the worlds knowledge. It's a language model. Mostly useful for bulk scams and filling voids in very sad lonely people's lives.

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#96
post #76
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s more a problem of tokenisation. In many cases, an LLM doesn’t see individual letters at all, so it can’t encode them one at a time.

I am quite sure GPT can undo tokenization if needed. It has no problem handling misspellings, plus you can just ask it to "spell things" L-I-K-E S-O.

I'm pretty sure there is a spellchecker ran before the tokenisation

also it is often wrong with spelling stuff out like that, especially with rarer or more interesting tokens

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#97
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can confirm that GPT 4 fails pretty badly on Middle Egyptian texts that are outside of its training set, using both MdC encoding and transliteration. I get translations which have at most a word or two in common with the original text. Almost pure hallucination.

From 'do robots dream' to 'how do we make them stop'

We have to wake them up, but probably not a good idea. :-O

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#98
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can confirm that GPT 4 fails pretty badly on Middle Egyptian texts that are outside of its training set, using both MdC encoding and transliteration. I get translations which have at most a word or two in common with the original text. Almost pure hallucination.

Chatgpt isn't a penultimate life form that contains all of the worlds knowledge. It's a language model. Mostly useful for bulk scams and filling voids in very sad lonely people's lives.

Why do you use "penultimate" here? (It means "second-to-last")

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#99
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd rather have access to less text that I know to be right then a lot that might be wrong in subtle ways I cannot detect.

That’s a reasonable take. The opposite take is also reasonable. So I think there will be a market for both.

There's a huge market for Real Housewives style 'reality' TV...

Re: Translating Akkadian clay tablets with ChatGPT?

#100

Translation is mostly wrong, it completely made things up. Source: studied Akkadian for two years in University.

Glad to see other students of Akkadian here!

Yeah, I had a little bit of luck with phonetic transcription - producing standard readings from the closely transcribed cuneiform. But mostly no. And it failed at translation with anything beyond the simplest two / three word phrases. Although the fact that it can do even that, sort of, is impressive, given that Akkadian -> English was certainly not something ChatGPT was optimized for.

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