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Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

davidlaprade.github.io

91–100 of 405 posts

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#91
post #21

2 weeks is the standard? I am amazed. In Switzerland where I live, it is 3 full calendar months. And I thought Switzerland is very similar to the USA... My god 2 weeks lol, someone quits and he is gone the next day. How is this legal?

> My god 2 weeks lol, someone quits and he is gone the next day. How is this legal? How is it legal for this not to be the case? We have constitutional laws against enslavement or indentured servitude here. Nobody can force you to work if you don’t want to. You can quit right now if you want to. What happens if you stop showing up to work in Switzerland? Do you go to prison?

You can be held in contempt for leaving your job in the US.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/24/us/thedacare-lawsuit-wisc...

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#92
post #72

LOL, I tried that at Apple, was immediately made to pack my stuff after watch of a security guard and escorted off premises. As if I couldn't copy their stuff first and give notice later if that was my intent. Now obviously, in a mom and pop shop, I would discuss my desire to leave before I even started looking and help find/train my replacement, while they would likewise help me find a new job that better fits my li…

Same thing happened to me - told my boss on a Friday that I had received a job offer with a 55% pay raise and was probably going to take it, so we should think about off-boarding. Later that day my admin rights to the gitlab org were removed, was told that "it was a mistake", and was fired the following Monday. They also took my $20k bonus that I was supposed to receive months earlier and used it as a carrot on a sti…

I love the "it was a mistake" "we're looking into it" "not sure what happened..." responses.

Not even just in this context, but in the context of everything. Corporate America is absolutely about deception and politics now, it isn't about working at all.

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#93
Disagree with this on several levels.

One specific challenge comes as tech companies push more and more compensation to bonuses and other must-be-present-to-win approaches (RSUs, etc). If you leave shortly before a trigger date, you've essentially been working the entire previous year at a discount, since your contractual bonus for the time you worked will never be paid. If you continue significantly past a cliff, then your transition time is being worked at a discount.

If you give significant notice, one of two things can happen. If you give notice before the cliff, planning to depart after the cliff (that is, maximizing the percentage of the time worked where the company actually pays you what they agreed you were worth), the company can accelerate the departure schedule and avoid paying out; if you give notice after the cliff, you're inherently volunteering for discount work for a company you didn't even want to work for at full price!

In practice, I think at this point that companies that choose to put a large amount of compensation behind a cliff this way are responsible for understanding the consequences of that choice. If you pay 30% or my annual comp, and that of all my peers, on Monthuary 15th, then you should assume that you will get a cluster of resignations on Monthuary 16th each year, that those departures will happen in the standard two weeks, and that because they are clustered you will be unlikely to hand off as easily and fully as if they were scattered. But hey, you managed to screw some of my coworkers who had to leave mid-year for family reasons out of a few bucks!

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#94
The most important thing is not to give a lot of notice when you quit, or to give a crap about how much notice you give them at all. It's when. If at all possible, you should give notice at or slightly beyond the first of the month. That way, when you leave, you will most likely retain your benefits through the rest of the month.

If your last day is say, the 28th, and you don't start a new job til the 2nd, then you're gonna be without benefits for the entire month.

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#95
Never thought about it this way, but makes a lot of sense. I gave 4 weeks notice one time because I had an especially large amount of knowledge-transfer to do, and it worked out about like described. And the "fun"/QOL aspects probably are reproducible at the right companies, now that I think about it

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#96
post #21

2 weeks is the standard? I am amazed. In Switzerland where I live, it is 3 full calendar months. And I thought Switzerland is very similar to the USA... My god 2 weeks lol, someone quits and he is gone the next day. How is this legal?

> My god 2 weeks lol, someone quits and he is gone the next day. How is this legal? How is it legal for this not to be the case? We have constitutional laws against enslavement or indentured servitude here. Nobody can force you to work if you don’t want to. You can quit right now if you want to. What happens if you stop showing up to work in Switzerland? Do you go to prison?

What happens in Europe if you're supposed to work out 3 months notice and you stop showing up:

- you stop getting paid. - you probably will have a hard time dealing with your former employers if you need something from them. - they think you're a dick, and tell other people, if asked, what an asshole you are. - potentially if they have nothing better to do, they get a lawyer to write you a threatening letter, then do nothing.

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My god 2 weeks lol, someone quits and he is gone the next day. How is this legal? How is it legal for this not to be the case? We have constitutional laws against enslavement or indentured servitude here. Nobody can force you to work if you don’t want to. You can quit right now if you want to. What happens if you stop showing up to work in Switzerland? Do you go to prison?

You can be held in contempt for leaving your job in the US. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/24/us/thedacare-lawsuit-wisc...

To be fair, this is Wisconsin. The judge is probably the guy that runs the hospital's brother-in-law.

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely agree. The part about infecting people with my attitude is especially relevant. It's normal that we talk. And when they ask "why?", it feels awkward. If I tell them all the reasons, it will influence their perception of their situation (which might be quite positive) and I prefer not to do that. But if I avoid answering, I will be perceived as dishonest or hiding something. So usually I invent some excus…

> But if I avoid answering, I will be perceived as dishonest or hiding something. So usually I invent some excuse so that nobody feels bad. So you avoid the perception of being dishonest and hiding something by actually being dishonest and hiding something?

You don't need to lie. There are plenty of generic reasons you can give why you're leaving that probably even have the virtue of having some truth to them. (Was time to make a change.) No reason to get into a blow-by-blow of why now and what all the things that made the situation less and less tolerable were.

It's not lying. It just not telling the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.

ADDED: Companies can also obviously be in a place where at least some of your reasons are so blindingly obvious they don't need to be stated.

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#99
post #72

LOL, I tried that at Apple, was immediately made to pack my stuff after watch of a security guard and escorted off premises. As if I couldn't copy their stuff first and give notice later if that was my intent. Now obviously, in a mom and pop shop, I would discuss my desire to leave before I even started looking and help find/train my replacement, while they would likewise help me find a new job that better fits my li…

Same thing happened to me - told my boss on a Friday that I had received a job offer with a 55% pay raise and was probably going to take it, so we should think about off-boarding. Later that day my admin rights to the gitlab org were removed, was told that "it was a mistake", and was fired the following Monday. They also took my $20k bonus that I was supposed to receive months earlier and used it as a carrot on a sti…

If your best friend abandoned you because you got a 55% raise and tried to give lots of notice, then your best friend was a jerk.

Good luck seriously in finding new and more quality friends! You'll find some!

Re: Career advice no one gave me: Give a lot of notice when you quit

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no contractual notice required to be given in the US. 72 hours notice in some states if you want to be paid out for everything they owe you on the spot. But otherwise I give them about as much notice as they would give me: at 4:59PM on Friday I send an email to HR informing them that today was my last day.

Can your contract state otherwise?

IANAL, but I don't think that a contract can force you to give a particular amount of notice no matter what (I think that would be considered "unconscionable"). But I imagine a contract could specify that if you don't give a certain amount of notice, you won't get severance or similar.
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