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Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

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Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#91

Post by jpadkins »

MonkeyMalarky wrote: post #35
donavanm wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The feds “dual mandate” is "maximum employment, stable prices, and moderate long-term interest rates." There’s too much employment at the moment, imperiling price stability and forcing their hand on interest rates. Inflation expectations, particularly”wage spiral”, are tied to unemployment. The historically low unemployment would/should drive further increases in wages due to scarcity/bargaining position of labor. Mo…

Wild to think a country can have both too much employment and millions living below the poverty line.

Not everyone has the same skills and capabilities.

Also the poverty line is a moving target. People with streaming TV and video game consoles are technically in poverty in the US. In the 1960-70s, access to those items would be only for ultra wealthy.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#92

Post by siwatanejo »

version_five wrote: post #84
onion2k wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient DO made a profit of a little over $250m in 2022, on revenue of $428.6m. That's a 60% margin. How much efficiency does a company need? EDIT: Correction.. those are the 2021 numbers. The latest numbers on the DO website for Q3 2022 state; " Gross profit of $97.6 million or 64% of revenue, an increase of 300 basis points year-over-year, and adjusted gross pro…

That doesn't address the point in the comment you replied to. He is talking about returns. The question is what return they made on invested capital. It might still be very good, I have no idea, but it's not the same as margin.

Wait, doesn't the invested capital equal the revenue minus the profits? That is, the expenses.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#93

Post by fleddr »

alephnerd wrote: post #16
jalino23 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how does interest rate affects company layoffs and why is being more efficient affects that? and why would FED want this? - serious question

To combat inflation in the housing market. A subset of White collar professionals (such as those in Tech, Real Estate, Finance) ended up earning so much that housing became unaffordable as a small but significant minority began buying multiple investment properties https://www.politico.com/news/2021/11/10/rent-inflation-bide... https://www.politico.com/news/2022/12/31/labor-market-high-i... “Tech and finance are taki…

Sounds more like a personal frustration.

Rates are hiked to combat a high CPI. Housing costs, with the exception of home-related taxes, are not even included in the CPI.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#94

Post by jethro_tell »

bad416f1f5a2 wrote: post #66
arcturus17 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very sorry to hear that, though you seem to have a fairly good outlook about it. Excuse me if it's callous to ask this at this time, but as I've been observing layoffs and been hearing that people are immediately shut down from their systems, I'm wondering: how do they communicate it to you if you can't access your email? Do they reach out to your personal email, call you, send you a letter? I might understand revoki…

When my company did layoffs recently I got to peek behind the curtain a bit. It started with an all-hands video call from the CEO announcing the layoff. HR had loaded emails to send immediately following the call directly to your company email that either said "you are not fired" or "you are". For those who were fired, infosec ran a script during the CEO call to pull their access packages for production systems, cran…

When I worked construction and a job was ending, you'd find out Friday if they needed you back.

They'd put your name on a list Monday and other jobs could pick you up if no one did, you'd have someone from HR come by and walk you through cobra insurance and hand you the forms for your unemployment, and then you had 30 minutes to pack your shit and go.

Weeks on end of wondering every Friday if you had a job next week. This was during 2008/10 and all our jobs that we had won got sent for rebid and the company declined to bid on them again. Lost all the work we had lined up and no one was hiring.

I was a real grind, guys expecting kids and hoping to get the baby delivered before the lost their health insurance.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#95

Post by scarface74 »

onion2k wrote: post #79
monero-xmr wrote: post #8

When interest rates are 0%, any amount of growth compounded over years is attractive. When you can get a 5% risk-free return from treasuries, even 7% rate of return is unattractive when compared to the safest asset on earth returning 5%. My point is, layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient, or interest rates go down.

layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient DO made a profit of a little over $250m in 2022, on revenue of $428.6m. That's a 60% margin. How much efficiency does a company need? EDIT: Correction.. those are the 2021 numbers. The latest numbers on the DO website for Q3 2022 state; " Gross profit of $97.6 million or 64% of revenue, an increase of 300 basis points year-over-year, and adjusted gross pro…

Any company can report a profit as long as they exclude actual expenses.

> We define adjusted gross profit as gross profit exclusive of stock-based compensation, amortization of capitalized internal-use software development costs and depreciation of our data center equipment included within Cost of revenue

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#96

Post by throwawaycopter »

steve-atx-7600 wrote: post #45
arcturus17 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very sorry to hear that, though you seem to have a fairly good outlook about it. Excuse me if it's callous to ask this at this time, but as I've been observing layoffs and been hearing that people are immediately shut down from their systems, I'm wondering: how do they communicate it to you if you can't access your email? Do they reach out to your personal email, call you, send you a letter? I might understand revoki…

I don't understand why it's necessary to treat employees with such sudden distrust. It is necessary to immediately cut off all access? These employees aren't being fired because they are suspected of perpetrating a crime, right? I I understand the need for layoffs, but I can't respect an organization/leadership that treats people so coldly. This behavior also affects non-fired employees that may have a need to ask kn…

> I don't understand why it's necessary to treat employees with such sudden distrust

To be honest, every employee should treat their employers with the same level of distrust.

It's important to have mutual mistrust as baseline for a healthy professional relationship.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#97

Post by 411111111111111 »

version_five wrote: post #84
onion2k wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient DO made a profit of a little over $250m in 2022, on revenue of $428.6m. That's a 60% margin. How much efficiency does a company need? EDIT: Correction.. those are the 2021 numbers. The latest numbers on the DO website for Q3 2022 state; " Gross profit of $97.6 million or 64% of revenue, an increase of 300 basis points year-over-year, and adjusted gross pro…

That doesn't address the point in the comment you replied to. He is talking about returns. The question is what return they made on invested capital. It might still be very good, I have no idea, but it's not the same as margin.

At 60% margin your argument becomes pretty disingenuous.

Sure, they're not the same but the quoted number is freely available and correlates with the returns.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#98

Post by taylodl »

AFriendlyBeagle wrote: post #56
jalino23 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how does interest rate affects company layoffs and why is being more efficient affects that? and why would FED want this? - serious question

Increasing interest rates can discourage investment by making it more expensive to borrow money, and by increasing the yield of savings relative to available investment targets. Corporations seeking investment in this climate might try to attract it by increasing the expected return on investment, which would involve committing fewer resources or achieving greater returns - being "more efficient". Labour costs are ty…

You are absolutely correct and I wish more people understood this: poverty is a feature of the system. People who tell poor people to just "get a job" don't understand how this system works. Also, there's no point in trying to figure out how to "fix" the system, i.e. eliminate poverty, because we've found no alternative that works save for one: social safety nets to ensure the poor are at least housed, clothed, and fed.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#99

Post by sct202 »

onion2k wrote: post #79
monero-xmr wrote: post #8

When interest rates are 0%, any amount of growth compounded over years is attractive. When you can get a 5% risk-free return from treasuries, even 7% rate of return is unattractive when compared to the safest asset on earth returning 5%. My point is, layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient, or interest rates go down.

layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient DO made a profit of a little over $250m in 2022, on revenue of $428.6m. That's a 60% margin. How much efficiency does a company need? EDIT: Correction.. those are the 2021 numbers. The latest numbers on the DO website for Q3 2022 state; " Gross profit of $97.6 million or 64% of revenue, an increase of 300 basis points year-over-year, and adjusted gross pro…

Gross profit is before a lot of people related expenses are taken out (R&D, sales and marketing, and other admin). Their net income was only $10m for the time frame you're quoting.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#100

Post by dcow »

sokoloff wrote: post #52
btbuildem wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prices never come down. Except maybe gasoline, after it jumps high in a panic now and again. Everything else just ratchets up, always. The best I can understand it, the low interest rates encourage lending / borrowing, which expands the money supply. As the supply of real goods and services is not keeping up, theres more money than goods, so prices of everything go up. Layoffs are a way of keeping wages down, but tha…

Some categories do deflate over time. Consumer electronics, cell phone services, toys are examples that are cheaper now than 10, 20, or 30 years ago. You can get a 43" 1080p TV for $150: https://www.bestbuy.com/site/insignia-43-class-n10-series-le...

I never quite understood this. For things that are new and novel it makes sense for price to decrease over time, like TV tech (do note that OLEDs today aren't any cheaper so the category is not TVs it’s LCD TVs). But games/toys it does not. It implies quality is lower or efficiency of production is higher and with something like video games I really doubt efficiency is higher. This is why I welcome the $10 price hike for video games. I want good games again.
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