Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

youtube.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 226 posts

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#91

Post by e12e »

roenxi wrote: post #84
eduction wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think your pattern is right except for "its weird and undocumented" - I have found the maintainers are superb at docs - e.g. deps.edn - there is a "Guide" https://clojure.org/guides/deps_and_cli there is a "Getting Started" https://clojure.org/guides/getting_started (it's branded as an overall Clojure getting started but the core of deps is just the clj/clojure command line tool you would use to install clojure) th…

"Superb" is not the word for deps.edn documentation. It is certainly documented but the gap between most Clojure documentation and the deps.edn documentation page is big. I suspect Rich wrote most of it but left the deps.edn page to someone else.The deps pages have a knack for includng pages of waffle that doesn't help to solve the current problem. If a newbie is trying to debug {:deps {ring/ring-devel {:mvn/version…

Out of curiosity - what is the correct form in this case?

Ed: I'm guessing a key => list of deps, maybe?

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#92

Post by cammsaul »

danuker wrote: post #67
revskill wrote: post #8

I tried Clojure, but when i look for a good ORM, what i see is a paid library.

There's this: https://github.com/metabase/toucan But beware what you do with it. Avoid DB side effects from business logic.

Hi, Toucan library author here.

+1 on avoiding side effects from business logic. This applies not just to Toucan, but to database code in general. Toucan is there to give you a way to define behaviors when interacting with your application database, for example transforming certain columns when you fetch rows from a certain table from the database. It's that plus utility functions for interacting with your database. Not really an ORM.

Either way, Toucan 2 is out now: https://github.com/camsaul/toucan2 I'm still working on fully documenting it but it's already being used in the wild and Toucan 1 will probably be archived soon

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#93

Post by grumpyprole »

e12e wrote: post #91
roenxi wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Superb" is not the word for deps.edn documentation. It is certainly documented but the gap between most Clojure documentation and the deps.edn documentation page is big. I suspect Rich wrote most of it but left the deps.edn page to someone else.The deps pages have a knack for includng pages of waffle that doesn't help to solve the current problem. If a newbie is trying to debug {:deps {ring/ring-devel {:mvn/version…

Out of curiosity - what is the correct form in this case? Ed: I'm guessing a key => list of deps, maybe?

I think you might be asking for a type :)

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#94

Post by seancorfield »

kelseyfrog wrote: post #37
rawoke083600 wrote: post #20

I've started learning Clojure about a year ago, couldn't say it was easy (the fault might be with me and not Clojure) Clojure has a lot a faults (just look at some of the comments here) BUT and it's a BIG BUT for me... Clojure is SUPER FUN :) Over the years(15+), I've been coding in PHP (suck it haters), Go, Rust,Java,Python AngularJS+, Svelte and I can honestly say for me, nothing is more fun that coding in Clojure.…

Clojure user here since 2010(my earliest Clojure project on Github), and while I agree with the fun point, the iceberg wart for me at this point is the inelegance of the interface hierarchy and its structure behind the scenes. Clojure's forward-facing interface (a hundred functions that operate on one data structure) ended up breaking down for me at some point and became 10 functions on 10 data structures and those d…

I've been programming with Clojure since 2010 and using it in production almost as long and I hardly ever care about the internal types so I'm really curious as to how you went down that "rabbit hole"? What sort of problems were you solving that necessitated delving into the implementation details behind the abstractions?

I've only needed to dig into that occasionally for a handful of specific situations (for example, in next.jdbc, where I create a hash map like abstraction over the (mutable) ResultSet object from Java -- to paper over some nasty interop issues).

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#95

Post by college_physics »

Clojure fans seem quite taken to hyperbole. If the language is such a "joy", "ultra-productive" etc I would have expected after such a long period of existence some major open source project to be showing off what the language attributes allow you to do.

Happy to stand corrected if there is such a slam-dunk showcase that I've missed, I am actually interested to dig into clojure, if nothing else as a way to deepen my understanding of functional programming.

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#96

Post by jdminhbg »

grumpyprole wrote: post #93
e12e wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity - what is the correct form in this case? Ed: I'm guessing a key => list of deps, maybe?

I think you might be asking for a type :)

Not really. This is a syntactic error, not a type error.

To expand, this is the equivalent of something like {"a": 1, "b":}. The type checker in something like Typescript wouldn't ever come into play, because it's not legal syntax to begin with.

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#97

Post by maxfurman »

college_physics wrote: post #95

Clojure fans seem quite taken to hyperbole. If the language is such a "joy", "ultra-productive" etc I would have expected after such a long period of existence some major open source project to be showing off what the language attributes allow you to do. Happy to stand corrected if there is such a slam-dunk showcase that I've missed, I am actually interested to dig into clojure, if nothing else as a way to deepen my…

There is something about the language and/or community that leads folks to build their own X instead of collaborating on a common open-source version of X.

Perhaps the lisp learning curve is high enough to dissuade those who want to contribute to a project but don't yet know Clojure?

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#98

Post by runevault »

beders wrote: post #75

Lisp has ruined me forever. I'm not sure how I can go back to other languages. I basically started out with Allegro Common Lisp on Sparc's, went to Java because it was the shiny new thing, and then in 2017 finally took the plunge and have been addicted to Clojure ever since. Don't get me wrong: the learning curve can be steep, but the steepness - at least in my case - came from un-learning all the object-oriented stu…

How is Clojure for dotNet? I haven't touched Clojure in general for years (honestly I think it's been at least a decade) but I remember a lot of libraries making calls expecting the Java standard library so seems like things would have broken, but maybe it is gotten a lot better in recent years.

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#99

Post by atdt »

yogthos wrote: post #48
rawoke083600 wrote: post #20

I've started learning Clojure about a year ago, couldn't say it was easy (the fault might be with me and not Clojure) Clojure has a lot a faults (just look at some of the comments here) BUT and it's a BIG BUT for me... Clojure is SUPER FUN :) Over the years(15+), I've been coding in PHP (suck it haters), Go, Rust,Java,Python AngularJS+, Svelte and I can honestly say for me, nothing is more fun that coding in Clojure.…

I've been working with Clojure for the past decade, and it's still the most enjoyable development experience I've had. Once you experience using an interactive workflow where you can see the results from the code you're writing live, it's really hard to go back.

Can you recommend a good YouTube video that demonstrates this? I'm used to writing code incrementally in Python via the IPython REPL. I've also used Twisted's Manhole to get a REPL inside an already-running Python server process. But I believe you're referring to something substantially richer than that.

Re: Clojure Turns 15 panel discussion video

#100

Post by brundolf »

One of the things that stands out to me in this video is seeing devs who are much older than the average dev I encounter, who have continued to grow deeper in their skills and form deeper insights, sharing some of those insights. It's something I don't get to see very often and it's encouraging
Post reply on HN