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Everything You Can’t Have

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91–97 of 97 posts

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#91

Rich people getting bored and unhappy is 200% on them and them only. I know of no less than 7 separate things I'd lose myself into -- all related to inventing stuff -- that I actually would be afraid if I'll be giving my wife enough attention. That's how active I would be if I didn't have to worry about a job and a salary. I know other people like myself as well, some more obsessed and downright hyperactive even. Peo…

The one thing I can't have is rest. I have approximations of rest: coping, procrastinating, dissociating. But the fantasy of achieving rest is something that I've had to let go of, like Sisyphus. After multiple boom-bust cycles and returning to the land of the living after burnout, I feel that the world's problems are caused by people who have too much either being unwilling or unable to empathize with the struggle o…

> The one thing I can't have is rest.

Story of my life. Get here for a virtual hug!

While I'd not be as spartan and ascetic as yourself I too 90% identify with your quote: "I want enough money to be left alone". I definitely will want a few dozen things I don't have now but I am also very convinced I'll know when to stop.

> No, the central crisis for me is that my standard of living depends on taking from others.

This can very easily spiral into extremes. Even Buddhist monks, to whom all life is sacred, laugh at those among them that don't dare weeding out the monastery garden lest they kill a worm while doing so. No disrespect to you meant, in fact I very strongly relate to you, but you do sound like you want to minimize harm in a way that's just not realistic and will end up burning you out in a different way compared to what you experienced working for the man.

I don't lose sleep over the fact that me ordering a $6.70 item from AliExpress maybe stimulates a guy running a sweat shop to keep exploiting people. I am not responsible for that and even if I have tilted the scales slightly here and there in my life I still view all of that as a fair transaction: if they couldn't offer it at that price then they wouldn't. But they do, so I order it and consume it after.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

With that being said, I'll always agree that we need to learn to consume the minimum because the way humanity is living right now is absolutely not sustainable and it will bite future generations super hard. That much is true. But I don't order napkins from AliExpress, no, so I am excused for wanting to try a curious novel (to me) shaver or buy my girlfriend a butterfly-shaped hair pin. Simple pleasures that hopefully harm nobody.

> But the wealthy don't do that. They just keep taking more and more and more, giving little or nothing back.

As another commenter here said: most people are not fit to be rich. They get rich too quickly or too easily and then realize they have no purpose, no hobbies, no goals, no struggles, so they spend the rest of their lives desperately trying to fill the internal void with material items which ironically they are well-aware will never gonna happen but feel trapped and hopeless so they keep trying anyway.

...Or date other rich people, which fails even more spectacularly.

...And they love pulling the ladder after they climbed it.

> But I've struggled for so long that it's all I have really known, to the point where I've lost sight of how to improve my situation.

Time for the next virtual hug as I am almost the same. I'll hit 43 next month and I am already dead-tired of all this circus and all the dumb charades and pretenses. The only thing that truly keeps me going is the absolute angel of a wife that I have, whose optimism and positivity are kind of contagious, and I want to show her a better life for both of us. Maybe along the way I'll find self-love as well, who knows.

> Surely there is at least one willing and able to speak out and step up.

I hate generalizing people so I am pretty sure benevolent rich people exist but (a) they are part of a much smaller group and them speaking up might actually be very harmful to them because others in the same group might actively sabotage them and (b) I completely understand somebody who fought for their life not wanting to spend the rest of it fighting for other people's lives (I know that if I make it I'll be one of the most anonymous rich guys you could think of).

You do get tired and burned out after all. Fighting with your own life is quite enough, and then some more even. You and I understand that pretty well.

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What’s the benefit of being rich then? Freedom. Owning better material items is only meant to facilitate freedom. I'm not a collector and never will be, even if I inherit two billion bucks tomorrow. Examples: - I'll get an expensive bike so me and my wife can go on an impulsive picnic in the outskirts of the city. - I'll get an extra house in rural France so we're free to go there if we need the scenery for a few w…

You took the question out of the context. Parent expressed that rich people would be happier by enjoying their wealth and changing and controlling what they want and how they enjoy it. That's the same thing 'poor' people can do - be happy by controlling their urges. For all your examples, as a poor guy: - I can control to enjoy a scenery or a picnic from local park or nearby forest and - I can control of being worrie…

I am not sure we disagree on anything, more like we look at it from different angles.

(There's a social and financial line below which you can't enjoy anything btw, and I don't wish even my worst enemies experiencing that -- because I did go through it).

RE: your expressed preferences: of course, they are your prerogatives. I'd go sit on a muddy grass every now and then, and travel with taxi to a fancy restaurant other times. One does not exclude the other.

> Once again, what's the benefit if I need to take a mental and physical effort in order to be happy?

You don't. It's quite the opposite: you drop the idea of status or belonging to special club or whatever, and you feel truly free. You don't have to prove anything to anyone. That's how I would be if I make it to the other side.

You could probably argue it's still effort as we have to learn to let go of certain toxic ego traits but that would be arguing semantics IMO. To me, letting go of stuff that's dragging you down is freedom even if you have to work for it a bit.

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#93
post #81

> A few years after leaving office, Richard Nixon mentioned that the richest people in the world are some of the unhappiest, because they can afford to never struggle. Except for those who choose a cause. Bill Gates comes to mind. > You feel that, gee, isn’t it just great to have enough money to afford to live in a very nice house, to be able to play golf, to have nice parties, to wear good clothes, to travel if you…

Good comment that matches my experience. I find that if the things I own are well made, and fill reals need or reasonable wants in my life, then I continue to enjoy them to a large extent, even if their novelty wears of. And this is true whether they were gifted to me or I struggled for them. > Your brain doesn’t want stuff. It doesn’t even want new stuff. It wants to engage in the process and anticipation of getting…

"Good comment that matches my experience. I find that if the things I own are well made"

That matches my experience too. With a bad, cheap guitar or shoes or a computer, I yearned for a better version thereof. Now I am playing a good guitar that I bought 10 years ago and I do not really feel any need to buy a more expensive one.

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#94
post #12

A bunch of other rich people don’t know how to enjoy their stuff but you don’t have to fall in that trap. There is a “mindfulness” angle. Instead of taking it always for granted, pay attention and make time enjoy your stuff. Thoigh if you keep realizing the things you have worked hard for don’t end up making you happy, that might be hopeless.

> There is a “mindfulness” angle. Instead of taking it always for granted, pay attention and make time enjoy your stuff. Being satisfied with what you have is what “poor” people (people who can’t have everything) do in order to be happy. What’s the benefit of being rich then?

[deleted]

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#95
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Being satisfied with what you have is what “poor” people (people who can’t have everything) do in order to be happy. What’s the benefit of being rich then? It's the ability to do what you want with your time, and to (increasingly with more wealth) say fuck you to people who try to force you into this or that. It's also the increased ability to change things (for you, others, your city, or even your whole country) t…

This is your take on being rich and not at all related to what the article was about, what parent said and the point I was trying to make.

This is rich people's take on being rich. It's not about buying expensive stuff - it can be about that for a while when you're newly rich, but it's a novelty that wears off really fast...

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#96
post #12

A bunch of other rich people don’t know how to enjoy their stuff but you don’t have to fall in that trap. There is a “mindfulness” angle. Instead of taking it always for granted, pay attention and make time enjoy your stuff. Thoigh if you keep realizing the things you have worked hard for don’t end up making you happy, that might be hopeless.

> There is a “mindfulness” angle. Instead of taking it always for granted, pay attention and make time enjoy your stuff. Being satisfied with what you have is what “poor” people (people who can’t have everything) do in order to be happy. What’s the benefit of being rich then?

It's much simpler:

The point of being rich is to have all the good stuff.

To get there, it helps if you're not too easily satisfied.

Alas, many rich people go overboard on not being satisfied. When they get all the good stuff, the have forgotten how to enjoy it.

But if you're smart about it you can make sure you enjoy stuff, and also get more stuff.

You are allowed to (gasp) enjoy your previous victories, without getting complacent. You can be happy about your yacht and also work hard to get a jet.

Unless, you know, you can't. But that's just a (common) mindset problem and I don't think you're doomed to fall in that trap.

I bet this "rich but unhappy" trope is appealing as a cope for the less fortunate. Thus it gets overplayed as a trope and people wrongly think it's universal truth rather than a cliché.

Re: Everything You Can’t Have

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are right it’s 100% on them to sort their life out. Like your 8 acquaintances I think most people are very unsuited for riches atleast until they adjust. Also almost all people think they themselves would be great managing that situation. It’s like imagining you will be great parent before you have kids. Or the famous quote, Everybody has a plan before they get punched in the mouth. Life change like that affects…

Getting a vacation when you have no job indeed sounds funny and meaningless, yes, but we also need a change of scenery every now and then, regardless of our level of wealth. It's a basic and universal human trait. And maybe I'll get tired of the tinkering I want to do now (but can't). I'd still like to find out if that's the case. There are creative pursuits that can take a lifetime however. Eventually you will find…

My main point is that there is a subset of humans who can never be bored. And it seems that it has no intersection with rich people. If that's indeed true (which I doubt; the world is not so black and white) it would be interesting to find out why.

During the pandemic, I found out that my superpower is that I can't get bored, I just dissociate. And I've noticed that wealthy people tend to prune off possibilities rather than explore them like I do, in other words, they never seem to daydream, but live in the hard reality of making difficult choices almost dispassionately, without imagination.

I had one bad day with covid where I couldn't get off the couch due to headache and dizziness, and felt an odd inclination that I wanted to play video games, because I couldn't. The last time I had felt an impulse to do something from inside was around 1992 (had a bunch of life-changing events the year after, and then went off to college and career). Ever since then, mostly the entirety of my life has been spent reacting to and dealing with external demands. So the feeling of motivation, however brief, was like tasting nirvana or glimpsing the sublime. Guess I'm still trapped in the 90s.

Anyway, I've spent so much of my life in that state of superposition that I solve problems almost automatically. People tell me anything at all, and my mind races through the branches and edge cases, arriving at the solution before they finish speaking. Like I solve problems in parallel, while others seem to do it serially. This is what I think the term neurodivergent is getting at.

The downside is that I don't perceive the difficulty of the problem, only the friction and artificial barriers preventing me from implementing the solution. Everything feels so contrived or even sabotaged (the theme of The X Files) that sometimes it feels like living in a nightmare where we all do everything the hard way by design, which is why I struggle so profoundly in a world designed for neurotypicals.

All I need is a minimum of time and resources to get ahead of the daily grind to get real work done. But those are the things that I can never seem to have. Because the people who favor tradition over outside the box thinking have the wealth. Which keeps us all stuck in a 20th century economy like The Matrix. Rich people seem to want to be the Merovingian, not Ironman or Batman.. at least that's how they present themselves as influencers, titans of industry, tech bros, etc.

But at the end of the day, I'm learning to let all of these preconceived and self-limiting beliefs go. Wealth is a construct, as are the generalizations we use to lump individuals together into stereotypes. Which means we hold the key to changing our own mindset. There's a power in surrendering to the unreachability of a logical solution and shifting to the reality/timeline in which it's already been solved. That's what magical thinking and manifestation and The Secret are about. I'm straying into the metaphysical now, but anyone who is self-aware or conscious or woke can do this. It all starts with meditation and bringing the outer reality into balance with the inner reality by reconnecting with the divine. But it's a red/blue pill thing, nobody can prove that it works or disprove it, we all just have to try it for ourselves.

I liked your response to my other comment, but figured I'd reply here. We're below the fold anyway now, but your insight deserved another.

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