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An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

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Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#91

Post by theonething »

flippinburgers wrote: post #38
brink wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's the general vibe on RoR nowadays? Most people that use it are fine and productive. Because of lazy evaluation, type issues persist though. Plenty of instances of trying to call string methods on integers, and array methods on nil, and Rails devs in denial that that's a big problem as the app continues to grow.

The main problem is active record insanity and poorly designed table relationships/indices that lead to maintenance nightmares.

> active record insanity

What exactly do you mean by that? It's just a bad ORM all around or is there something specific that is insane about it?

> poorly designed table relationships/indices

What does that have to do with Rails? Poorly designed database models are the fault of the developer(s) who designed them.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#92

Post by sergiotapia »

brntsllvn wrote: post #2

I was a devoted rails fan 10 years ago, but haven't looked back since full stack typescript. What's the general vibe on RoR nowadays?

I recently tried Nextjs and Remix to explore other stacks since I've been using Elixir and Phoenix since 2016.

You won't find the dev UX you take for granted in Elixir and Phoenix.

Endless routing options, background jobs? Just install Squirrel and yadabadabadoo or just use AWS SQS(https://old.reddit.com/r/nextjs/comments/qspw4v/how_to_do_ba...). What about solid backend processes? Can I call those in some kind of repl? In Elixir I can just go `iex -S mix phx.server` and `MyModule.foobar("test")` and bada bing I'm all set. What about logging? Wait I need to decide and configure a logger? I also need to decide and configure what to output to? What about a nice ORM? Prisma looks good, set that whole thing up from scratch, I need to await, but special considerations need to be thought of when iterating through a collection? Promise.all vs for..of? I iterated an array and want to save it to the DB but it's running out of connections (https://github.com/prisma/prisma/discussions/16884)? Why do I even need to think about this?

Really curious to hear your counterpoints to this because granted I am quite new to backend typescript.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#93

Post by shafyy »

mike1o1 wrote: post #67

I love Rails and how simple and boring[0] it is, and appreciate how it keeps evolving and growing. I've dabbled with some Javascript frameworks and Elixir/Phoenix, but always come back to Rails and forget just how fast and productive I can be. A lot of people complain about it, but I feel like Active Record just can't be beat, and helps me feel so productive. Add Stimulus and Turbo and the level of UI fidelity possib…

I love how they focus on simplicity and are not afraid to cut stuff out. Often times, software projects get more complicated over time. Rails seems to get simpler.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#94

Post by troysk »

cguess wrote: post #8
aliqot wrote: post #5

Quoted post unavailable.

Shopify and Github being run on Rails sorta put it to bed a long time ago.

Adding a few more to the list; Twitch, dribbble, hulu, zendesk, airBnB, Square, Kickstarter, Heroku, Coinbase, Soundcloud, cookpad, slideshare.

I guess, if you choose Rails, there is more chance you will build something beyond MVP as you get to focus on what you build not how.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#95

Post by Rafert »

whatever1 wrote: post #81
VWWHFSfQ wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depending on what your app is, I've found server-side rendering to be superior in nearly every way. I don't use Rails but Django is the same way. Django templates, bootstrap, jQuery and sprinkle in a little bit of HTMX here and there and my productivity has never been higher.

If you are building for a single target (aka web browser) I agree, it’s very easy to access your ORM with SSR. But if you plan to support multiple targets (web, mobile, headless) then you have to develop an api anyway so why not use the best front end framework for each of your targets?

The Basecamp folks feel that web and mobile are the same target: https://turbo.hotwired.dev/handbook/native

Rails doesn't stop you from building a backend for your React and React Native frontends, for example just look at Shopify.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#96

Post by oleg_antonyan »

brink wrote: post #10
brntsllvn wrote: post #2

I was a devoted rails fan 10 years ago, but haven't looked back since full stack typescript. What's the general vibe on RoR nowadays?

> What's the general vibe on RoR nowadays? Most people that use it are fine and productive. Because of lazy evaluation, type issues persist though. Plenty of instances of trying to call string methods on integers, and array methods on nil, and Rails devs in denial that that's a big problem as the app continues to grow.

I use type assertions for this https://github.com/olegantonyan/typerb

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#97

Post by oleg_antonyan »

Alifatisk wrote: post #62
brink wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's the general vibe on RoR nowadays? Most people that use it are fine and productive. Because of lazy evaluation, type issues persist though. Plenty of instances of trying to call string methods on integers, and array methods on nil, and Rails devs in denial that that's a big problem as the app continues to grow.

I have to agree on this one, it feels like some people are in denial of type issues within the Ruby / Rails community. I've been experimenting with Rbs, Sorbet & Contracts though, they have their potential.

The UX is terrible. Separate file for types is just inconvenient. I wish it was something like Python's optional typing

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#98

Post by methehack »

andrei_says_ wrote: post #70
brntsllvn wrote: post #2

I was a devoted rails fan 10 years ago, but haven't looked back since full stack typescript. What's the general vibe on RoR nowadays?

I’ve never seen a more productive stack. Enables me to build complete apps as a single dev - which would take 2x-5x of the time and effort if using separate front end apps. Ruby makes me happy when I use it. Hotwire and Stimulus let me create front end interactions without a separate SPA. The ecosystem is mature and well maintained. Absolutely love it.

Rails is really a gift. It's so productive and works so great on teams because of the heavy conventions I think. And the ruby library ecosystem is insanely good. Libraries generally do what they say they're going to do and there are libraries for everything. I've wondered a lot about why this is. Heavy air time? Is there something about ruby?

Every now and then I try some new web app framework that catches my eye in some new language and it always seems like its just getting started compared to rails -- and, it is. Worth noting -- rails works great API only as well. I bet Django is pretty good by now too of course, but Rails is really a fantastic tool well suited to task.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#99

Post by jonahx »

mike1o1 wrote: post #67

I love Rails and how simple and boring[0] it is, and appreciate how it keeps evolving and growing. I've dabbled with some Javascript frameworks and Elixir/Phoenix, but always come back to Rails and forget just how fast and productive I can be. A lot of people complain about it, but I feel like Active Record just can't be beat, and helps me feel so productive. Add Stimulus and Turbo and the level of UI fidelity possib…

You can like rails, but calling it boringly simple is highly misleading. I think, generously, something like "complex but fully-featured" might be accurate.

As a reference point, the top 2 rails books on amazon are 900 and almost 1100 pages.

I say this to warn those who are looking for something minimalist and quick to learn -- Rails does not fit the bill.

Re: An Overview Of Upcoming Ruby on Rails 7.1 Features Part 1

#100

Post by 0x457 »

jonahx wrote: post #99
mike1o1 wrote: post #67

I love Rails and how simple and boring[0] it is, and appreciate how it keeps evolving and growing. I've dabbled with some Javascript frameworks and Elixir/Phoenix, but always come back to Rails and forget just how fast and productive I can be. A lot of people complain about it, but I feel like Active Record just can't be beat, and helps me feel so productive. Add Stimulus and Turbo and the level of UI fidelity possib…

You can like rails, but calling it boringly simple is highly misleading. I think, generously, something like "complex but fully-featured" might be accurate. As a reference point, the top 2 rails books on amazon are 900 and almost 1100 pages. I say this to warn those who are looking for something minimalist and quick to learn -- Rails does not fit the bill.

nah, at this point RoR is boring (in a good way), and it's a good thing.
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