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The gathering crisis in the UK

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Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#91

Post by jacquesm »

stickfigure wrote: post #51
Victerius wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or an opportunity for a powerful figure to take power by force and rule over all. I'm not for dictatorships, but we already have too many countries in the world. And provinces and states within these countries. Too many little fiefdoms. Too many wannabe lords. Too many presidents, premiers, prime ministers, governors, chancellors, kings, emperors. Too many parliaments, congresses, too many senators, deputies, represe…

Was this translated from original Russian? Honestly, it really does sound like you're for dictatorships. I think all that diversity - sure, even competing bases on the Moon - is the sign of a healthy society. Monoculture is much more perilous. Centralization gives you NASA, market chaos gives you SpaceX.

Without NASA there would not be a SpaceX.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#92

Post by klelatti »

ajb wrote: post #83
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The standard approach for the government now seems to be to look for short term wins in the tabloids and ignore the long term. Was this ever not the case?

There's a useful distinction between lying and bullshitting: liers know what the truth is and want to convince you it's something else, bullshitters don't even care (or potentially, even know) what the truth is. Governments often did things which failed and then tried to paint them as wins. They also often went for short term wins. But they were real wins (in the short term) even if they failed to get them. I think i…

Absolutely. Levelling up is a case in point. Sounds good and wins votes but never any serious intention to follow through.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#93

Post by usgroup »

reggieband wrote: post #78

I am reminded of the story of the fat cat that I recently read in a Brothers Grimm collection. In case it is not familiar to you: A cat and a mouse decide to team up and store up some surplus food for hard times. They agree during abundant times to both put a little extra fat into a shared pot. They then store the pot in a safe place. The cat, however, is overcome by hunger even in the abundant times. Every few weeks…

Are you talking about the budget deficit? It’s not really like a pot you only look into when times are hard since it’s constantly known.

I really like your metaphor, but it is misleading.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#94

Post by null4bl3 »

reggieband wrote: post #78

I am reminded of the story of the fat cat that I recently read in a Brothers Grimm collection. In case it is not familiar to you: A cat and a mouse decide to team up and store up some surplus food for hard times. They agree during abundant times to both put a little extra fat into a shared pot. They then store the pot in a safe place. The cat, however, is overcome by hunger even in the abundant times. Every few weeks…

The world needs more guillotines

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#95

Post by colechristensen »

wffurr wrote: post #82
colechristensen wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup. A big thing in past decades was energy independence. The US actually achieved it but it didn't get the attention that griping about not having it got.

I mean sort of. If fuel prices are still at the whim of global markets, does it matter if the country is a net importer or not? Electrification with domestic electricity supply seems like it would provide much greater security. Though there's still the global markets for all the electronics and materials and such for renewable generation.

>If fuel prices are still at the whim of global markets, does it matter if the country is a net importer or not?

But they are not completely at the whim.

With a nontrivial lag time, as prices raise, local (especially North America as a whole) production will go up and NA will become a significant net exporter. The shale and tar sands production is considerably more expensive than other production methods and requires high prices (and predictions of long term high prices) to operate successfully.

We are coupled, but not entirely dependent. The local price will be progressively lower compared to global price as global price rises. Being able to overproduce our requirements enables this.

If high prices significantly (for some sufficiently high level of significance) threatened our local economy or supply actually limited people's ability to buy at any price, controls can and would be enacted to decouple the local price and economy from the global market.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#96

Post by banannaise »

usgroup wrote: post #93
reggieband wrote: post #78

I am reminded of the story of the fat cat that I recently read in a Brothers Grimm collection. In case it is not familiar to you: A cat and a mouse decide to team up and store up some surplus food for hard times. They agree during abundant times to both put a little extra fat into a shared pot. They then store the pot in a safe place. The cat, however, is overcome by hunger even in the abundant times. Every few weeks…

Are you talking about the budget deficit? It’s not really like a pot you only look into when times are hard since it’s constantly known. I really like your metaphor, but it is misleading.

It's not the budget. It's the hidden cuts to services, the declining maintenance to infrastructure, the privatization of essentials. Those are the licks they take from the pot, while they tell you the pot is still full.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#97

Post by MrRiddle »

null4bl3 wrote: post #94
reggieband wrote: post #78

I am reminded of the story of the fat cat that I recently read in a Brothers Grimm collection. In case it is not familiar to you: A cat and a mouse decide to team up and store up some surplus food for hard times. They agree during abundant times to both put a little extra fat into a shared pot. They then store the pot in a safe place. The cat, however, is overcome by hunger even in the abundant times. Every few weeks…

The world needs more guillotines

Eh, we have something similar, the problem seems to be we’re not putting those who deserve it in them.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#98

Post by radicaldreamer »

Victerius wrote: post #14
reb wrote: post #4

It’s eerie how similar the issues facing western nations are and how intractable the disagreements over solutions have become. Desperate balkanization coming for many, I think.

Or an opportunity for a powerful figure to take power by force and rule over all. I'm not for dictatorships, but we already have too many countries in the world. And provinces and states within these countries. Too many little fiefdoms. Too many wannabe lords. Too many presidents, premiers, prime ministers, governors, chancellors, kings, emperors. Too many parliaments, congresses, too many senators, deputies, represe…

This reads a lot like calls for fascism in the interwar years.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#99

Post by TrueGeek »

mnd999 wrote: post #62
UncleOxidant wrote: post #5

"Brexit has delivered some deregulation, though: notably, the Conservative government ditched EU standards on effluent discharges, resulting in the (private) water companies discharging raw sewage into almost every river, and the seas around the UK coastline. So it is no longer safe to swim in UK waters." Holy crap! "the Bank of England are forecasting 13% inflation towards the end of the year." And we thought things…

It’s pretty grim at the moment.

But where do you think it'll be in 10 years? Progress is being made towards renewable energy, people are taking trips by bicycle more, and although the change hasn't happened yet, public sentiment is that the NHS needs to be "fixed", whatever that may end up meaning.

Re: The gathering crisis in the UK

#100

Post by pasabagi »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #5

"Brexit has delivered some deregulation, though: notably, the Conservative government ditched EU standards on effluent discharges, resulting in the (private) water companies discharging raw sewage into almost every river, and the seas around the UK coastline. So it is no longer safe to swim in UK waters." Holy crap! "the Bank of England are forecasting 13% inflation towards the end of the year." And we thought things…

It depends on who you ask. If you ask any british person who has been out of the country for a few years, yes, it's absolutely going down the pipes.

If you ask people who have lived there the whole time, they've been frog-boiled.

The truth is somewhere in the middle: the current malaise is a continuation of pre-existing trends. There were always holes in british roads, now there are just more of them. There were always food banks, now they just run out of food before they run out of hungry people.

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