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Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

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Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#91

Post by cmeacham98 »

chjj wrote: post #72
cmeacham98 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give an example of a wikipedia page that you think shows bias on the same level as PragerU?

This is one of the most clear examples of bias in favor of leftism that I've seen on wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_marxism > The term "Cultural Marxism" refers to a far-right antisemitic conspiracy theory which claims that Western Marxism is the basis of continuing academic and intellectual efforts to subvert Western culture. I feel like a lot of actual marxists would disagree with this statement.…

Just because they use the term "cultural" on Anotonio Gramsci's page doesn't make him part of "continuing academic and intellectual efforts to subvert Western culture". Can you substantiate that claim, or is that just made up?

> Also, the last time I looked at the cultural marxism article, it simply said a "far-right conspiracy theory". Now they've somehow managed to roll up antisemitism in there too. Apparently it became antisemitic in just the past year or two!

This is the first ever revision of the article that isn't simply a redirect, and it contains the term: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Cultural_Marxism_...

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#92

Post by hither_shores »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #90
hither_shores wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Browse through https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Wikipedia_neutral_poi... and you'll find plenty. For example: > Mohammed Zakir (also known as Meyra) was an Ethiopian Oromo nationalist. Regarded as "legendary Oromo hero", he is noted for his high contribution to keep the lights of Oromo nationalism shining after the martyrdom of his two hero colleagues called Elemo Qiltu and Ahmad Taqi ... the Oromos would never…

If you go to the page in question (available here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Zakir_Meyra ) it has not one but two warnings at the top of the page about the content within. Is this not an example of Wikipedia's process working as intended?

There's been an NPOV warning on that page since 2011, and the content has remained substantially the same since 2010. So no, I don't think it is.

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#93

Post by cmeacham98 »

hither_shores wrote: post #92
cmeacham98 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you go to the page in question (available here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Zakir_Meyra ) it has not one but two warnings at the top of the page about the content within. Is this not an example of Wikipedia's process working as intended?

There's been an NPOV warning on that page since 2011, and the content has remained substantially the same since 2010. So no, I don't think it is.

Wikipedia runs off of community contributions. This person seems to be extremely obscure, as searching the full name 'Mohammed Zakir Meyra' I found this Wikipedia article, websites that scrape Wikipedia and post its contents, and garbage SEO-optimized websites that had nothing to do with the person. I gave up trying to find anything that wasn't SEO garbage or a Wikipedia scrape on page 5 of the search results.

At least in the English speaking world, this person seems to be a nobody and nobody seems to care enough to fix this article. Honestly, someone that knows how the process works on Wikipedia more than me should probably submit it for deletion, as this (at least in my opinion) shouldn't even meet Wikipedia's notability standards.

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#95

Post by gwern »

DontchaKnowit wrote: post #64

Can we stop calling stuff like this a "study"? This is not science, this is essentially journalism. I mean technically yes they are "studying" a subject but this is not a scientific experiment, but it will almost certainly be cited as such just because it's called a study.

This is definitely a study and science. It's actually a rather high quality experiment too, I was in awe of the way they carefully constructed the pairs of decisions to make them as identical as possible, and then got the same law student to write an article for each member of a pair before randomizing to ensure they were written as similarly as possible. Everyone knows that you should be blocking to maximize statistical power, but very few people ever go that far. (And that's probably a good part of why despite the relatively small _n_, they still get very clear causal effects.)

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#96

Post by chjj »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #91
chjj wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the most clear examples of bias in favor of leftism that I've seen on wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_marxism > The term "Cultural Marxism" refers to a far-right antisemitic conspiracy theory which claims that Western Marxism is the basis of continuing academic and intellectual efforts to subvert Western culture. I feel like a lot of actual marxists would disagree with this statement.…

Just because they use the term "cultural" on Anotonio Gramsci's page doesn't make him part of "continuing academic and intellectual efforts to subvert Western culture". Can you substantiate that claim, or is that just made up? > Also, the last time I looked at the cultural marxism article, it simply said a "far-right conspiracy theory". Now they've somehow managed to roll up antisemitism in there too. Apparently it b…

Antonio Gramsci asserted that the reason Marx's predictions of late-stage capitalism never came to fruition was due to cultural institutions propping up capitalism. He states very clearly that the (new) objective of marxism should be to establish a counter-hegemony within the existing cultural hegemony, thereby subverting it.

This is all present in Gramsci's prison notebooks[1] and is common knowledge to anyone who has ever studied marxist intellectual literature at any length. I find it ridiculous that wikipedia would claim this is a "conspiracy theory". Marxists speak about this _very_ candidly in their writings.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_Notebooks

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#97

Post by cmeacham98 »

chjj wrote: post #96
cmeacham98 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because they use the term "cultural" on Anotonio Gramsci's page doesn't make him part of "continuing academic and intellectual efforts to subvert Western culture". Can you substantiate that claim, or is that just made up? > Also, the last time I looked at the cultural marxism article, it simply said a "far-right conspiracy theory". Now they've somehow managed to roll up antisemitism in there too. Apparently it b…

Antonio Gramsci asserted that the reason Marx's predictions of late-stage capitalism never came to fruition was due to cultural institutions propping up capitalism. He states very clearly that the (new) objective of marxism should be to establish a counter-hegemony within the existing cultural hegemony, thereby subverting it. This is all present in Gramsci's prison notebooks[1] and is common knowledge to anyone who h…

This still does not provide any proof for the claim. Of course Marxists want to promote their ideology, even culturally. Nobody denies this. The claim made by people using the term "Cultural Marxism", and the reason it is a conspiracy theory, is that said Marxists do so for the purpose of destroying Western culture.

Again, to be clear: I am not asking for proof that Marxists promoted Marxism (obviously they did), but that they did so "to subvert Western culture".

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#98

Post by bdowling »

tediousdemise wrote: post #82
6177c40f wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about it makes it not science?

Concluding that knowledge influences behavior isn't science. It's common sense.

A conclusion supported by carefully collected data is science. A conclusion based on common sense is not.

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#99

Post by headsoup »

squeaky-clean wrote: post #32
headsoup wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends if it's true though, right? Let's not dismiss everything because culture wars.

If it's true there's probably a less controversial source that reported on it. If a controversial source is the only place to report on something, it's probably not true.

And the 'non-controversial' sources post only truth then?

This is really un-critical logic being applied to news consumption.

Re: Study finds Wikipedia influences judicial behavior

#100

Post by chjj »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #97
chjj wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Antonio Gramsci asserted that the reason Marx's predictions of late-stage capitalism never came to fruition was due to cultural institutions propping up capitalism. He states very clearly that the (new) objective of marxism should be to establish a counter-hegemony within the existing cultural hegemony, thereby subverting it. This is all present in Gramsci's prison notebooks[1] and is common knowledge to anyone who h…

This still does not provide any proof for the claim. Of course Marxists want to promote their ideology, even culturally. Nobody denies this. The claim made by people using the term "Cultural Marxism", and the reason it is a conspiracy theory, is that said Marxists do so for the purpose of destroying Western culture. Again, to be clear: I am not asking for proof that Marxists promoted Marxism (obviously they did), but…

Again, Gramsci and later followers of Gramsci advocated infiltrating cultural institutions and establishing a counter-hegemony to subvert the existing cultural hegemony. That should be enough to satisfy anyone's definition of cultural marxism. Read Gramsci or any other cultural marxist if you want proof.

edit: I'll also point out that Mao's cultural revolution in China was the first implementation of Gramsci's vision of cultural marxism. There's no way to know whether Mao had ever read Gramsci, but it's not out of the realm of possibility.

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